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  #11  
Old 05-14-2014, 05:29 PM
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red, indeed it is. so long as the mindless feed from the "it's for national security" chorus continues to buy into the rhetoric of course.

my hope is that, thanks to bush's adventurism, our society and corrupt "representatives" are second-guessing our devotion to the military industrial complex. as we currently stand, including dramatic cuts to military spending, we are more than overly-equipped to defend against any foreign incursion on our homeland.

for example, russia is a second-rate power, and we have no military options in their pursuit over ukraine and other countries.
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  #12  
Old 10-30-2014, 05:50 PM
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From the looks of it, it would've been far cheaper to redesign the F-22 raptor for a strike fighter/attack role. The amount of gouging of the taxpayer by defence contractors in the F-35 is unbelievable. Australia is to receive 100 F-35's and we've been waiting a long time for them.
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  #13  
Old 10-30-2014, 07:15 PM
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Don't think so. The Raptor F22 is even more expensive than the F-35 JSF. And it was purpose designed as a fighter, not as a bomber or recon craft.

The whole problem has already been laid out in these posts: the Air Force tried an old and already discredited tactic of promising one plane does all. It's like saying a minivan can not only haul a soccer team to practice, but also a load of 4x8 plywood and even run a few laps at Indy. Meanwhile the Air Force is trying to jettison a capable jet that the Army troops loves because it saves their asses on the battlefield: the A-10 Warthog. The excuse? Too many different planes to support. The answer? One plane that is supposed to do all but does nothing well and currently has trouble getting off the ground and staying in the air.

Why does the Air Force persist in this mythology? Well, maybe it's because the bean counters with any real grasp of what it takes to win a battle are pulling the strings. Maybe it's a cynical political gambit to get maximum budgetary approval regardless of how effectively the funds will be spent. WTF, back in the 1800's the Empress of China funded a new navy. Her minions turned around and spent it all on a monumental marble boat that was a work of art but had to sit on the bottom of the charming decorative pond it was placed in for show. The F35 isn't yet a marble battleship but... it's getting there...
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  #14  
Old 10-30-2014, 08:12 PM
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I am neither for or against this program. I will say that when dealing with countries like Russia and China, the ONLY advantage we might have is to have better technology than they do.

Is it right to try to have this technology?

I don't know, but are we willing to find out?

Mark
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  #15  
Old 10-30-2014, 11:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PBTime View Post
Don't think so. The Raptor F22 is even more expensive than the F-35 JSF. And it was purpose designed as a fighter, not as a bomber or recon craft.

The whole problem has already been laid out in these posts: the Air Force tried an old and already discredited tactic of promising one plane does all. It's like saying a minivan can not only haul a soccer team to practice, but also a load of 4x8 plywood and even run a few laps at Indy. Meanwhile the Air Force is trying to jettison a capable jet that the Army troops loves because it saves their asses on the battlefield: the A-10 Warthog. The excuse? Too many different planes to support. The answer? One plane that is supposed to do all but does nothing well and currently has trouble getting off the ground and staying in the air.

Why does the Air Force persist in this mythology? Well, maybe it's because the bean counters with any real grasp of what it takes to win a battle are pulling the strings. Maybe it's a cynical political gambit to get maximum budgetary approval regardless of how effectively the funds will be spent. WTF, back in the 1800's the Empress of China funded a new navy. Her minions turned around and spent it all on a monumental marble boat that was a work of art but had to sit on the bottom of the charming decorative pond it was placed in for show. The F35 isn't yet a marble battleship but... it's getting there...
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  #16  
Old 11-05-2014, 04:11 PM
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The entire Department of Defense needs some serious budget trimming. I know it's not popular and even viewed as unpatriotic by some but it's necessary and long overdue. It wouldn't need the sky-high budget it has now if we would stop meddling around overseas and concentrate on training and protecting the borders.
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  #17  
Old 11-08-2014, 07:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Red Eft View Post
it's the governments way of creating jobs...not by providing anything useful but on helping a select group get richer.
It's job security, namely it's a way that Congress critters in the states and districts these programs are based in can say they're "creating jobs." As noted, it's funny how the government can't create jobs except when it's in the defense industry.
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  #18  
Old 11-10-2014, 05:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CdrMike View Post
It's job security, namely it's a way that Congress critters in the states and districts these programs are based in can say they're "creating jobs." As noted, it's funny how the government can't create jobs except when it's in the defense industry.
Uncle Sam wants you...

...to build bigger bombs at home so the Israeli's can drop them on Gaza.

...to build more fighter planes to sit on runways.

...to hide all corruption within the miltary and its spending habits.

...to allow the NSA to completely track and document your life.

...to never disagree with Big Govt and Big Corporations.

...to blindly agree and follow a set of values the govt has long forgotten.

...to choose from only two parties which will, regardless of choice, always act in favor of more govt power over your life.
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  #19  
Old 11-10-2014, 05:45 AM
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By the way. to be noted:

American Jet Figther technology is around 20-30 years behind the Russian capabilities. Raptor 22 being a solid copy of a much older MIG/SU22. The United States since before World War II, has never led the way in terms of aviation, except maybe stealth fighter(90's). This may come as a shock to many people on these forums who are peppered so heavily with American Exceptionalism that they forgot the fact they lost the Space Race to the CCCP in terms of first person in space and first satellite, so again, in regards to aviation the US only plays catchup and theft through espionage.
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  #20  
Old 11-12-2014, 03:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levski View Post
By the way. to be noted:

American Jet Figther technology is around 20-30 years behind the Russian capabilities. Raptor 22 being a solid copy of a much older MIG/SU22. The United States since before World War II, has never led the way in terms of aviation, except maybe stealth fighter(90's). This may come as a shock to many people on these forums who are peppered so heavily with American Exceptionalism that they forgot the fact they lost the Space Race to the CCCP in terms of first person in space and first satellite, so again, in regards to aviation the US only plays catchup and theft through espionage.
Levski.. what kind of weed are you smoking?? Raptor a copy of SU22 Flitter. wTF?? The only soviet plane that even gets to play in that rarified air is the T-50 and that is just going into production
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