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  #11  
Old 01-02-2018, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by djharkavy View Post
The study's finding apparently confirms what is already known. It's not negating global warming, but instead explaining why it hasn't yet gone out of control.


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Actually the study says nothing about anthropocentric global warming. In that respect it may well be irrelevant.

It only addresses "tectonic" causes of atmospheric CO2 increases.
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  #12  
Old 01-02-2018, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by PBTime View Post
"Overall, therefore, this study shows that IF a tectonic-driven climate control (degassing) can push the climate system out of balance, a temperature-dependent feedback via silicate weathering will eventually stabilise the climate. "

Note not only the big IF (my emphasis), but also the vagueness of the term "eventually", as well as the complete lack of mention of whether or not they have shown that weathering can reverse the effects of man-made CO2 increases, let alone in a timely fashion to save millions of lives that may be affected by rising sea levels and other ill effects of global warming.

Rather than try to discredit the authors, I'm asking you to back up their paper with peer review commentary. If you don't have any, then the paper is far less authoritative than you or your binge-watching author seem to think.
Why? I posted the OP. The article, along with linked paper on which OP was based. I noted it was a confirmation for me that Earth pretty much took care of herself irrespective of human activity. If you disagree with that statement of my belief, or the study itself, it's up to you to provide a sourced argument. It's not up to me to prove my source material. If you do not yhink it accurate, relevant, or authoritative enough, show why you think so. THEN you can ask gorgeous additional sourcing from me.
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  #13  
Old 01-02-2018, 11:39 AM
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It is not up to me to prove a negative.

Get that straight and come back when you grasp it.
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"Camille Paglia calling herself a feminist is sort of like a Nazi saying they're not anti-Semitic." - Gloria Steinem

"Negotiating with President Trump is like negotiating with Jell-O," Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.)

"Conservatism is the opioid of the greedy." - PBTime

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  #14  
Old 01-02-2018, 11:49 AM
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Scientific consensus: Earth's climate is warming
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Multiple studies published in peer-reviewed scientific journals1 show that 97 percent or more of actively publishing climate scientists agree*: Climate-warming trends over the past century are extremely likely due to human activities. In addition, most of the leading scientific organizations worldwide have issued public statements endorsing this position. The following is a partial list of these organizations, along with links to their published statements and a selection of related resources.
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"Camille Paglia calling herself a feminist is sort of like a Nazi saying they're not anti-Semitic." - Gloria Steinem

"Negotiating with President Trump is like negotiating with Jell-O," Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.)

"Conservatism is the opioid of the greedy." - PBTime

"Blessed are the shithole countries, for they gave us the American dream." - Bono




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  #15  
Old 01-02-2018, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by PBTime View Post
It is not up to me to prove a negative.

Get that straight and come back when you grasp it.
In a debate, one side states its position and provides source material for that position. I have done that. Then the opposing party - that's you in this case - states its opinion and provides source material for that position. you have not done that. If you question either my position or the source material I provided to back up my position, it's up to you to provide that info. Not me. I'm not debating myself here. It's a discussion, a debate, a conversation between, in this instance, you and me.

Not asking you to prove a negative. I'm telling you that you have to provide sourced info for calling into question my position and source material. Otherwise, it's simply your opinion, not your informed opinion.
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"I’m remaining a registered Democrat because I still hope for the reform of my party" C. Paglia

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  #16  
Old 01-02-2018, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Trish View Post
In a debate, one side states its position and provides source material for that position. I have done that. Then the opposing party - that's you in this case - states its opinion and provides source material for that position. you have not done that. If you question either my position or the source material I provided to back up my position, it's up to you to provide that info. Not me. I'm not debating myself here. It's a discussion, a debate, a conversation between, in this instance, you and me.

Not asking you to prove a negative. I'm telling you that you have to provide sourced info for calling into question my position and source material. Otherwise, it's simply your opinion, not your informed opinion.
I just did. Either you haven't seen it yet, or you got nothing in return.
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"Camille Paglia calling herself a feminist is sort of like a Nazi saying they're not anti-Semitic." - Gloria Steinem

"Negotiating with President Trump is like negotiating with Jell-O," Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.)

"Conservatism is the opioid of the greedy." - PBTime

"Blessed are the shithole countries, for they gave us the American dream." - Bono




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  #17  
Old 01-02-2018, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by PBTime View Post
I just did. Either you haven't seen it yet, or you got nothing in return.
Well You're right, I didn't see that response. But I'm kinda puzzled. If indeed the "extremely likely" cause of climate change in the last century is due to human activities how does that invalidate the info in the OP? I mean the OP talks about a self-regulating thermostat. Humans turn it up with their activities and the Earth adjusts. The temps get too cold and the Earth adjusts. I know that's an extremely simplistic explanation but it's enough I think to prompt the discussion. Seems to me the info you provided in no way invalidates the info in the OP or the position I took. I'm not arguing climate change exists, or even that human activities don't have an impact. I'm simply saying that the report behind the OP reinforces my position that the Earth takes care of herself, irregardless of we humans and our activities.
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"Since when did Democrats become so judgmental and intolerant?" C. Paglia

“When I look at the political situation now, all I really see is that the Democrats are against the Republicans, the Republicans are against the Democrats, and no one’s really for America.” S. Barclay

"I’m remaining a registered Democrat because I still hope for the reform of my party" C. Paglia

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  #18  
Old 01-02-2018, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Trish View Post
Well You're right, I didn't see that response. But I'm kinda puzzled. If indeed the "extremely likely" cause of climate change in the last century is due to human activities how does that invalidate the info in the OP? I mean the OP talks about a self-regulating thermostat. Humans turn it up with their activities and the Earth adjusts. The temps get too cold and the Earth adjusts. I know that's an extremely simplistic explanation but it's enough I think to prompt the discussion. Seems to me the info you provided in no way invalidates the info in the OP or the position I took. I'm not arguing climate change exists, or even that human activities don't have an impact. I'm simply saying that the report behind the OP reinforces my position that the Earth takes care of herself, irregardless of we humans and our activities.
Not really. You're extrapolating from the OP to draw conclusions it probably doesn't support. Such as that humans cannot cause global warming because the earth will self-regulate CO2 levels. This flies in the face of the geologic record, where the earth has undergone many temperature cycles, which have lasted thousands if not millions of years. The difference today is that human CO2 emissions have resulted in atmospheric CO2 levels in a far shorter time that has been in the past from geologic processes. So if you think we're A-OK spewing out all the CO2 we want because the weathering process will fix it, you're sadly mistaken. Maybe you think you'll live to be 1,000 years old, because that's at least how long it will likely take for weathering to "fix" the current elevated CO2 levels.

And, again, your "paper" didn't prove anything about human caused global warming: it doesn't even mention it.

And as for the earth taking care of itself, try reading up on the great global glaciation period, which if I recall correctly lasted millions of years when the globe was encased in ice, or the millions of years of polar tropics. Yes, there are natural earth temperature cycles, and we've been lucky enough to evolve during a period where the temps have been more stable than other more extreme periods in the earth's history. Perhaps that gives some a false sense of security.

The scientific consensus seems to be that there is a tipping point where increased atmospheric CO2 level will cause a warming process that cannot be stopped by limiting CO2 emissions, and that this tipping point is closer than we should be comfortable about. This is the irony about positions such as yours; when you finally have proof you seem to require that the earth is in a runaway warming due to man's emissions, it will be too late to do anything about it. You and I will probably be dead by then, but our descendants, if any, might have a rather dim view of attitudes such as yours.
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"Camille Paglia calling herself a feminist is sort of like a Nazi saying they're not anti-Semitic." - Gloria Steinem

"Negotiating with President Trump is like negotiating with Jell-O," Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.)

"Conservatism is the opioid of the greedy." - PBTime

"Blessed are the shithole countries, for they gave us the American dream." - Bono




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  #19  
Old 01-02-2018, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by PBTime View Post
Not really. You're extrapolating from the OP to draw conclusions it probably doesn't support. Such as that humans cannot cause global warming because the earth will self-regulate CO2 levels. This flies in the face of the geologic record, where the earth has undergone many temperature cycles, which have lasted thousands if not millions of years. The difference today is that human CO2 emissions have resulted in atmospheric CO2 levels in a far shorter time that has been in the past from geologic processes. So if you think we're A-OK spewing out all the CO2 we want because the weathering process will fix it, you're sadly mistaken. Maybe you think you'll live to be 1,000 years old, because that's at least how long it will likely take for weathering to "fix" the current elevated CO2 levels.

And, again, your "paper" didn't prove anything about human caused global warming: it doesn't even mention it.

And as for the earth taking care of itself, try reading up on the great global glaciation period, which if I recall correctly lasted millions of years when the globe was encased in ice, or the millions of years of polar tropics. Yes, there are natural earth temperature cycles, and we've been lucky enough to evolve during a period where the temps have been more stable than other more extreme periods in the earth's history. Perhaps that gives some a false sense of security.

The scientific consensus seems to be that there is a tipping point where increased atmospheric CO2 level will cause a warming process that cannot be stopped by limiting CO2 emissions, and that this tipping point is closer than we should be comfortable about. This is the irony about positions such as yours; when you finally have proof you seem to require that the earth is in a runaway warming due to man's emissions, it will be too late to do anything about it. You and I will probably be dead by then, but our descendants, if any, might have a rather dim view of attitudes such as yours.
I don't believe that's accurate. The report wasn't about the cause of climate change, whatever the cause. It was about how the zearth responds to extreme climate change. Whether the cause extreme climate change is human activities or not, the Earth would still regulate itself. I don't think there's any indication of how quickly that happens - just that it does.
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"Since when did Democrats become so judgmental and intolerant?" C. Paglia

“When I look at the political situation now, all I really see is that the Democrats are against the Republicans, the Republicans are against the Democrats, and no one’s really for America.” S. Barclay

"I’m remaining a registered Democrat because I still hope for the reform of my party" C. Paglia

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." Edmund Burke
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  #20  
Old 01-02-2018, 10:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Trish View Post
I don't believe that's accurate. The report wasn't about the cause of climate change, whatever the cause. It was about how the zearth responds to extreme climate change. Whether the cause extreme climate change is human activities or not, the Earth would still regulate itself. I don't think there's any indication of how quickly that happens - just that it does.
You have made it sound like you believe that this self regulation will negate man made global warming, so there's no need for us to do anything about CO2 and other greenhouse gases.

Is that really what you think?

A simple yes or no will do.
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"Camille Paglia calling herself a feminist is sort of like a Nazi saying they're not anti-Semitic." - Gloria Steinem

"Negotiating with President Trump is like negotiating with Jell-O," Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.)

"Conservatism is the opioid of the greedy." - PBTime

"Blessed are the shithole countries, for they gave us the American dream." - Bono




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