Conservatives turn

[lily]

Well.........we have a thread about why Liberals suck and one on how to be a
good homosexual.........so I guess it's time we had one on what makes
conservatives tick.

I don't understand how conservatives can live being scared of their own shadow.
They must bomb countries, because they are coming to get us. It doesn't
matter that those countries can't get past our air security and have no way
to come and get us.
People can't
speak out, because it will embolden the enemy.
They must wiretap all
citizens,
because.....well you just never know!
They must not let homosexuals get
married, because it's going to ruin either their definition of marriage, or
the word marriage......you can call it something else, but it's going to
hurt them somehow if you call it a marriage.
They can't talk to their
enemies, because that would show weakness. They must threaten.
They can't
discuss with the Democrats, because that would seem to be giving in and
somehow stripping them of their "power".
They can't admit that this war was run by incompetent people, because that would admit they followed this through all these years, without speaking up.

So in closing..........why are Conservatives scared of their own shadow?

[AnnEsthesia]

You forgot the whole 'war on christmas' thing. Why does 'Happy Holidays' and 'holiday tree' make them so furious?

[Scorpion]

Shhh! What's that noise? Sounds like mice scurrying in a darkened room. Nah, it's just some politically challenged liberals entertaining themselves. If you leave them alone they usually just go away dragging their tails..

:madlaugh:

[AnnEsthesia]

I guess we can add 'Why do conservatives feel the need to toss out derogatory comments when they are not called for?' to your list of questions, lily.

[Alonzo]

Why do conservatives have so many divorces, and so much teen pregnancy?

[AnnEsthesia]

Good question, Zo.

[BoogyMan]

Why do conservatives have so many divorces, and so much teen pregnancy?


Because, just as in any other ideological group, there are many hypocrites among those who call themselves conservatives.

[Alonzo]

But why do conservatives have higher rates than liberals? Or at least the places they live do.

[underdawg]

Good answer Boogy. I will agree with that.

[Buck Laser]

Lily, I appreciate the fact that you compiled your own thoughts to raise these questions about conservative behavior. It seems to me that when conservatives put up similar challenges to any of the many people they oppose or fear, they always quote some "authority." That may be a fundamental part of conservative orientation--to feel the need to appeal to some authority beyond themselves, whether it be the Bible (always as they interpret it, of course!), or a supposed historical tradition (and if it doesn't exist, they're glad to invent it), or one of their icons.

Neither liberals, conservatives, libertarians nor anyone else owns a corner on the truth: I'd like to think that those of us on the left are a little more cautious about claiming divine sanction for our ideas. I know we're better at admitting our mistakes! :nana:

There does seem to be a culture of fear, dislike and a bit of rigidity among conservatives that keeps them disgruntled a good bit of the time. There also seems to be a need to respond with smartass remarks that kinda preclude serious discussions about the differences in how liberals and conservatives approach the world.

The fear I see displayed by so many conservatives leads me to make challenging and (sadly) disparaging remarks toward many of them. Yet I know as a liberal that there are certainly flaws in the way I approach things. For example, I could legitimately be called wishy-washy in my lack of ability to decide between desirable courses of action; I tend to dismiss conservative proposals as draconian or unduly harsh; I fail to recognize that a good many conservatives rely on big corporations for their livelihood, and feel threatened when we propose tighter restrictions on those corporations.

I wish the road to cooperation and progress wasn't as full of switchbacks and detours as it seems to be. I s'pose each side in this liberal-conservative debate never passes up a chance to diss the other side. You'd think we both would've learned something in the twentieth century. :sadly:

[Scorpion]

Lily, I appreciate the fact that you compiled your own thoughts to raise these questions about conservative behavior. It seems to me that when conservatives put up similar challenges to any of the many people they oppose or fear, they always quote some "authority." That may be a fundamental part of conservative orientation--to feel the need to appeal to some authority beyond themselves, whether it be the Bible (always as they interpret it, of course!), or a supposed historical tradition (and if it doesn't exist, they're glad to invent it), or one of their icons.

Neither liberals, conservatives, libertarians nor anyone else owns a corner on the truth: I'd like to think that those of us on the left are a little more cautious about claiming divine sanction for our ideas. I know we're better at admitting our mistakes! :nana:

There does seem to be a culture of fear, dislike and a bit of rigidity among conservatives that keeps them disgruntled a good bit of the time. There also seems to be a need to respond with smartass remarks that kinda preclude serious discussions about the differences in how liberals and conservatives approach the world.

The fear I see displayed by so many conservatives leads me to make challenging and (sadly) disparaging remarks toward many of them. Yet I know as a liberal that there are certainly flaws in the way I approach things. For example, I could legitimately be called wishy-washy in my lack of ability to decide between desirable courses of action; I tend to dismiss conservative proposals as draconian or unduly harsh; I fail to recognize that a good many conservatives rely on big corporations for their livelihood, and feel threatened when we propose tighter restrictions on those corporations.

I wish the road to cooperation and progress wasn't as full of switchbacks and detours as it seems to be. I s'pose each side in this liberal-conservative debate never passes up a chance to diss the other side. You'd think we both would've learned something in the twentieth century. :sadly:


An excellent example of liberal pontification. Very entertaining but equally disengenuous.

[Buck Laser]

An excellent example of liberal pontification. Very entertaining but equally disengenuous.

Well, so much for dialogue...why am I not in the least surprised? I guess it's easier to flip us off than to think. But if that's what you want, then be my guest...

[Pookie]

Mercy! I thought that was an excellent post by Lily. I think she was honest about how she views certain things and even more honest with herself and her own feelings. I didn't see any liberal pontificating there at all.
I'd like to add to Lily's post with my two cents: I think both sides are equally right and equally wrong. No one does have the whole, perfect truth. The closest we will ever get to the truth and real solutions is to listen to each other and consider viewpoints that might be unusual to us.
I really don't think we'll get anywhere by throwing barbs and dismissing each other's ideas as "liberal pontification" and "disengenuous." That's the first mistake, right there. By blowing off each other's ideas, we slam the door to any type of real truth or real solutions, and real debate as well. And from there, anything has a better chance of becoming a mud-slinging, insulting free-for-all.
The dingbats in Washington on both sides of the aisle already have that down to a science. I don't feel the need to perpetuate those actions here.
I'll bet that both conservatives and liberals in here would be dang near shocked to find out how many ideas we might have in common.
Purrs,

[Scorpion]

Well.........we have a thread about why Liberals suck and one on how to be a
good homosexual.........so I guess it's time we had one on what makes
conservatives tick.

I don't understand how conservatives can live being scared of their own shadow.
They must bomb countries, because they are coming to get us. It doesn't
matter that those countries can't get past our air security and have no way
to come and get us.
People can't
speak out, because it will embolden the enemy.
They must wiretap all
citizens,
because.....well you just never know!
They must not let homosexuals get
married, because it's going to ruin either their definition of marriage, or
the word marriage......you can call it something else, but it's going to
hurt them somehow if you call it a marriage.
They can't talk to their
enemies, because that would show weakness. They must threaten.
They can't
discuss with the Democrats, because that would seem to be giving in and
somehow stripping them of their "power".
They can't admit that this war was run by incompetent people, because that would admit they followed this through all these years, without speaking up.

So in closing..........why are Conservatives scared of their own shadow?


In light of your opening post, why not assign a more accurate title to this thread. "Conservatives: The Evil of the World."

Geez. :madlaugh:

[Elrathin]

In light of your opening post, why not assign a more accurate title to this thread. "Conservatives: The Evil of the World."

Geez. :madlaugh:


It's funny, there is a thread about liberals and you all high five each other on your comments, but there is a thread criticizing conservatives and you equate that to "Conservatives are evil'.

What do you see from the contents of this thread that equates conservatives are evil? Just curious.

I mean this thread is NOTHING like the thread about liberals titles "Why liberals Such" which is derogatory in its start.

[Scorpion]

In light of your opening post, why not assign a more accurate title to this thread. "Conservatives: The Evil of the World."

Geez. :madlaugh:


It's funny, there is a thread about liberals and you all high five each other on your comments, but there is a thread criticizing conservatives and you equate that to "Conservatives are evil'.

What do you see from the contents of this thread that equates conservatives are evil? Just curious.


Read the opening post. According to it conservatives are regarded as the cause of all that's wrong.

[Elrathin]

Read the opening post. According to it conservatives are regarded as the cause of all that's wrong.


No I read it, it lists certain THOUGHTS about conservatives, not that all conservatives are evil. Which is nothing like " Why liberals suck" thread where you all high five each other.

And your little cartoon only emphasizes my point about many of you conservatives.

[Whilst]

In all seriousness, which political party is the true harbinger of doom and gloom? If the world is destined to end because of man's use of fossil fuels, I'd like to see a time table.

[Elrathin]

In all seriousness, which political party is the true harbinger of doom and gloom? If the world is destined to end because of man's use of fossil fuels, I'd like to see a time table.


Depends on which Doom and Gloom you're talking about. To many conservatives if gay marriage is legalized, it will begin the rapture.

[Whilst]

In all seriousness, which political party is the true harbinger of doom and gloom? If the world is destined to end because of man's use of fossil fuels, I'd like to see a time table.


Depends on which Doom and Gloom you're talking about. To many conservatives if gay marriage is legalized, it will begin the rapture.


I thought we were talking about the end of the world. It makes sense since conservatives are in charge doesn't it?

In other words, I really don't give a crap who you burn with.

[Elrathin]

I thought we were talking about the end of the world. It makes sense since conservatives are in charge doesn't it?

I am a liberal and never have claimed such a thing, don't know what you are talking about there.


In other words, I really don't give a crap who you burn with.


What's really gonna be ironic is those people that think they got religion all figured out only to possibly burn in a hell of their own making cause they chose the wrong one, Christians included.

[Pookie]

I am not a conservative, but from what I have noticed is, truly, that conservatives tend, for the most part, to be against abortion and gay marriage, to be for big corporations, to poo-poo the idea of climate changes and global warming, and other issues like those.
There's even one I can think of who has a gay daughter but thinks it's okay to shoot a buddy in the face while hunting. That's scary.
But let the conservatives weigh in on this topic. What DOES make you folks tick, anyway?
Purrs,

[Scorpion]

I am not a conservative, but from what I have noticed is, truly, that conservatives tend, for the most part, to be against abortion and gay marriage, to be for big corporations, to poo-poo the idea of climate changes and global warming, and other issues like those.
There's even one I can think of who has a gay daughter but thinks it's okay to shoot a buddy in the face while hunting. That's scary.
But let the conservatives weigh in on this topic. What DOES make you folks tick, anyway?
Purrs,


I think that conservatives tend to be problem solvers who get the job done whereas liberals tend to point out problems and bicker about who's fault they are and how to solve them.

[moses2792796]

Conservatives? Problem solvers? I mean ok I can see your point about liberals but please, conservatives use an absolutist system of morals to determine what is evil and when something goes wrong they declare it the fault of this evil and proceed to drop bombs on it, rather than look within.

[Scorpion]

Conservatives? Problem solvers? I mean ok I can see your point about liberals but please, conservatives use an absolutist system of morals to determine what is evil and when something goes wrong they declare it the fault of this evil and proceed to drop bombs on it, rather than look within.


Exactly. Like I said, problem solvers.

[Pookie]

Ok, problem-solvers should have had this mess in Iraq over with, the democratic government in place, the war in Afghanistan finished with the overthrow of Al Quada and the capture of Bin Laden.
Or at least keep the dang lights on in Iraq! Mercy! And mismanaging money, even demanding wounded soldiers give back parts of their bonuses, the Walter Reed mess, the mismanagement of Hurricane Katrina funds, the FEMA debacle there and on the Gulf Coast, key members of the Bush administration being indicted and investigated...and the list goes on. I have to be honest, and this isn't picking on anyone, but I don't see a whole lot of problem-solving going on there. I don't see a lot of problem-solving going on across the aisle, either, so I think both sides are lousy at solving problems.
Anything else that makes you folks tick?
Purrs,

[Scorpion]

Ok, problem-solvers should have had this mess in Iraq over with, the democratic government in place, the war in Afghanistan finished with the overthrow of Al Quada and the capture of Bin Laden.


We're trying but the cut and run liberals keep trying to get us to pull out before the job is done.

http://stix1972.typepad.com/stix_blog/images/cutnrunmd.jpg

Hey Pookie, when do you sleep?

[Pookie]

I work the midnight shift. Sleep? Whassat?
Purrs,

[Scorpion]

I work the midnight shift. Sleep? Whassat?
Purrs,


Understood. I'm on call at the hospital tonight so no sleep for me.

[Alonzo]

I am not a conservative, but from what I have noticed is, truly, that conservatives tend, for the most part, to be against abortion and gay marriage, to be for big corporations, to poo-poo the idea of climate changes and global warming, and other issues like those.
There's even one I can think of who has a gay daughter but thinks it's okay to shoot a buddy in the face while hunting. That's scary.
But let the conservatives weigh in on this topic. What DOES make you folks tick, anyway?
Purrs,


I think that conservatives tend to be problem solvers who get the job done whereas liberals tend to point out problems and bicker about who's fault they are and how to solve them.


Bush must be the worlds biggest liberal then.

[Scorpion]

I am not a conservative, but from what I have noticed is, truly, that conservatives tend, for the most part, to be against abortion and gay marriage, to be for big corporations, to poo-poo the idea of climate changes and global warming, and other issues like those.
There's even one I can think of who has a gay daughter but thinks it's okay to shoot a buddy in the face while hunting. That's scary.
But let the conservatives weigh in on this topic. What DOES make you folks tick, anyway?
Purrs,


I think that conservatives tend to be problem solvers who get the job done whereas liberals tend to point out problems and bicker about who's fault they are and how to solve them.


Bush must be the worlds biggest liberal then.


Even the liberals wouldn't want him, and they take anyone.

[ticbeast]

If conservatives are problem solves, then why during their time in power...
...have we failed at securing our boarders?
...have we failed in an illegitimate war?
...did the assult weapons ban expire?
...has the national image tarnished?
...is Osama Bin Laden still in a cave?
...do we have no universal medical care?
...is the national debt in the trillions of dollars?

Please do not get me wrong. Liberals haven't done much either. Frankly politicians haven't done much of anything recently. But could someone back up the assertion that "conservatives are problem solvers" with some examples of them solving something recently?

[I Like Beer]

But could someone back up the assertion that "conservatives are problem solvers" with some examples of them solving something recently?

I've asked Scorpion to do this. He pointed to (I think) social security as a POTENTIAL problem that conservatives would have solved but were unable to because of liberals.

When I asked for an actual example in the recent past - there was no response.

[Elrathin]

Ok, problem-solvers should have had this mess in Iraq over with, the democratic government in place, the war in Afghanistan finished with the overthrow of Al Quada and the capture of Bin Laden.


We're trying but the cut and run liberals keep trying to get us to pull out before the job is done.


Wait a minute, so you are blaming liberals because we are not out of Iraq yet? The Dems in congress have given the administration everything they have asked for in money. No, conservatives that blame liberals for us still being in Iraq are not problem solvers, they are the problem.

[I Like Beer]

I grew up as a conservative. I changed in my mid twenties after about four difficult years of soul searching. To this day, most of my family are conservatives.

Of course, I was a conservative because my family was and I just adopted their opinions - as I'm sure most do. Looking back on my time as a conservative, I would say that, in general, I bought into the 'emotional' argument. Or, the argument that on the surface, seemed or felt 'correct'.

For example, on the surface capital punishment seems logical. You kill someone, you deserve to die. That makes sense both emotionally and at first glance. However, when you start digging into it and start asking questions, it starts to fall apart. It's not a deterrent, innocent people will get killed by the state, it's not applied equally to all, and on and on.

This is not to say that conservatives are less intelligent than liberals. Obviously, there are some very intelligent conservatives and I don't mean to imply that. I just think they tend to look at things more emotionally or cursorily and less logically.

Here's another example, the teaching of creationism in science class.

At first glance, it makes sense. Both are "theories" and both have support in the community. However, when you look at it logically, creationism has no place in a science class because it provides no testable hypothesis (it can't be investigated) and has no evidence to support it.

Here's my main problem with conservatives. Some of the very things they tend to value in themselves (nationalism, religious conviction in some cases) they fear in others.

What conservative wouldn't prefer a liberal, secular government in Iran?

[lily]

In light of your opening post, why not assign a more accurate title to this thread. "Conservatives: The Evil of the World."

Geez. :madlaugh:



I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion, Scorpion, when I clearly stated my reason for starting this thread in the first sentence. I must have touched some nerve, as I see no response to the points, only criticizm of the reason why the thread was started.[hr]


I thought we were talking about the end of the world. It makes sense since conservatives are in charge doesn't it?

In other words, I really don't give a crap who you burn with.


You've lost me here. The end of the world? I thought my post was about fear and how conservatives make their decisons and run their campaigns on it.

[hr]


We're trying but the cut and run liberals keep trying to get us to pull out before the job is done.



Can you explain to me how exactly? The Democrats, to the disdain of their voters have given Bush everyhting he's asked for. Only a choice few of those that are running didn't and that's because of their conscience and probably in the most part so they can get re-elected. I'd also like to add in the senator of my state Levin, who has stuck by his decisions.

[hr]All these replies and still no answer on why Conservatives are afraid of their own shadow. Is it because none of their fears are real?

[Pookie]

Ok, problem-solvers should have had this mess in Iraq over with, the democratic government in place, the war in Afghanistan finished with the overthrow of Al Quada and the capture of Bin Laden.


We're trying but the cut and run liberals keep trying to get us to pull out before the job is done.


Ok, but didn't the Republican majority in Congress and the Senate have control from 9/11 up to November of 2006? Why didn't they get it down then? I'm not trying to pick on you, Scorp, but it just seems that there is nothing but blame going around on both sides and no problems are getting solved at all. Democrats blame Republicans for messes, and even Republicans have gone so far as to blame the Clinton administration for things.
I think we should all just stop blaming and get down to business. That's what this new Congress and Senate were supposed to do.
Hope you got some sleep today, Scorp.
Purrs,

[Scorpion]

Ok, problem-solvers should have had this mess in Iraq over with, the democratic government in place, the war in Afghanistan finished with the overthrow of Al Quada and the capture of Bin Laden.


We're trying but the cut and run liberals keep trying to get us to pull out before the job is done.


Ok, but didn't the Republican majority in Congress and the Senate have control from 9/11 up to November of 2006? Why didn't they get it down then? I'm not trying to pick on you, Scorp, but it just seems that there is nothing but blame going around on both sides and no problems are getting solved at all. Democrats blame Republicans for messes, and even Republicans have gone so far as to blame the Clinton administration for things.
I think we should all just stop blaming and get down to business. That's what this new Congress and Senate were supposed to do.
Hope you got some sleep today, Scorp.
Purrs,


Both sides of the aisle agreed to the War in Iraq and Afghanistan, it wasn't, as some like to believe, a purely Republican expedition. It was when the going got tough that the left began to waffle, point fingers, demand an immediate exit, but offer very little in the way of a viable solution to problems in the war zone. I do agree that both Democrats and Republicans are equally at fault for this mess.

The Democratically controlled congress has failed miserably resulting in a distrust of both political camps by the public. It's one reason some politicians are retiring or declining to run.

Sleep? What's that. Pet the cat for me.

[K-D-K-D-K]

Ok, problem-solvers should have had this mess in Iraq over with, the democratic government in place, the war in Afghanistan finished with the overthrow of Al Quada and the capture of Bin Laden.


We're trying but the cut and run liberals keep trying to get us to pull out before the job is done.


Ok, but didn't the Republican majority in Congress and the Senate have control from 9/11 up to November of 2006? Why didn't they get it down then? I'm not trying to pick on you, Scorp, but it just seems that there is nothing but blame going around on both sides and no problems are getting solved at all. Democrats blame Republicans for messes, and even Republicans have gone so far as to blame the Clinton administration for things.
I think we should all just stop blaming and get down to business. That's what this new Congress and Senate were supposed to do.
Hope you got some sleep today, Scorp.
Purrs,
The thing people need to realize is that the U.S. just signed a agreement with Iraq that will put our troops under Iraq control and that it will keep our troops there for a long time. We need to be there and prevent Iran from building nuclear weapons and causing a arms race in the Middle East. People need to accept this fact.

[Pookie]

The thing people need to realize is that the U.S. just signed a agreement with Iraq that will put our troops under Iraq control and that it will keep our troops there for a long time. We need to be there and prevent Iran from building nuclear weapons and causing a arms race in the Middle East. People need to accept this fact.


I didn't hear about any agreement like this. Then again, I've only been catching headlines lately -- busy, busy.
US troops under Iraqi control? For God's sake, the Iraqis aren't ready to control car traffic over there, much less our troops.
Are you sure about this? They can't even keep the lights on! Do you have any articles about this, links, or something about this agreement? I find this a little hard to believe, and being a liberal, THAT may be hard to believe too.
Geez! What brainless, spineless, gutless pissant would sign a thing like that? Whoever it was, I already don't like him/her.
Any links to back this up would be welcome.
Thanks!
Purrs,

[Pookie]

Think I found one, but it's al-Jazeera and I don't trust that as far as I could throw it.
Purrs,

[ECW]

Think I found one, but it's al-Jazeera and I don't trust that as far as I could throw it.
Purrs,


ECW to the Pook's rescue:

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hcWJu9bbzrJZ7uNHjvMn0BuTGqHQD8T5KQMG0

[Pookie]

Well, not complete control, no, and details are still pending, but if this is problem-solving the Republican way, I don't think too many Americans are going to like it.
And Bush will probably dump that in his successor's lap while he rides off into the sunset as the worst President in history.
What a mistake.
Thanks, ECW!
Purrs,

[Scorpion]

Ok, problem-solvers should have had this mess in Iraq over with, the democratic government in place, the war in Afghanistan finished with the overthrow of Al Quada and the capture of Bin Laden.


We're trying but the cut and run liberals keep trying to get us to pull out before the job is done.


Ok, but didn't the Republican majority in Congress and the Senate have control from 9/11 up to November of 2006? Why didn't they get it down then? I'm not trying to pick on you, Scorp, but it just seems that there is nothing but blame going around on both sides and no problems are getting solved at all. Democrats blame Republicans for messes, and even Republicans have gone so far as to blame the Clinton administration for things.
I think we should all just stop blaming and get down to business. That's what this new Congress and Senate were supposed to do.
Hope you got some sleep today, Scorp.
Purrs,
The thing people need to realize is that the U.S. just signed a agreement with Iraq that will put our troops under Iraq control and that it will keep our troops there for a long time. We need to be there and prevent Iran from building nuclear weapons and causing a arms race in the Middle East. People need to accept this fact.


That is a preliminary document, not a finalized agreement. Until it is finalized it is nothing more then a draft of suggested action.

[lily]

I didn't hear about any agreement like this. Then again, I've only been catching headlines lately -- busy, busy.
US troops under Iraqi control? For God's sake, the Iraqis aren't ready to control car traffic over there, much less our troops.
Are you sure about this? They can't even keep the lights on! Do you have any articles about this, links, or something about this agreement? I find this a little hard to believe, and being a liberal, THAT may be hard to believe too.
Geez! What brainless, spineless, gutless pissant would sign a thing like that? Whoever it was, I already don't like him/her.
Any links to back this up would be welcome.
Thanks!
Purrs,


http://www.democracyforums.com/showthread.php?tid=9510

We have everything you need, right here at DF Pookie.:D