Our American Madrassas

[ClayBarham]

Muslim schools, known as madrassas, teach Muslim viewpoints on just about everything in the world. There is always a viewpoint. At best, the skill training Muslim children receive is more on how to make a bomb to murder infidels and receive a death reward in Paradise of 72 virgins to molest. Improving their minds, to think more than feel, to sharpen their skills and talents, and achieve what they personally aspire to achieve, are never taught. Those things isolate each child as an individual, not a member of the Muslim anthill. They learn to accept and believe in what the mullahs, ayatollahs, sheiks, imams and teachers preach repeatedly, that non-Muslims are to be murdered along with those who stray from their narrow path.

In America, the K-12 schools are the madrassas of the American left. American children are taught their nation is bad in just about every respect. There are no redeeming qualities to America or Americans. Americans pay for them to learn this, of course. The children are taught to follow their feelings, feelings encouraged by teachers who are taught to hate individual self-interests and favor community interests they define. Skills, which, when taught and learned, may be assimilated differently by each student reflecting his or her interests, are avoided. Individual excellence is discouraged in favor of group excellence. Children who exhibit high intellectual development are labeled mentally troubled and handicapped.

Teachers tell their students that capitalism is an economic system at odds with humanity and America is the most violent and corrupt nation on earth. Teachers tell their children about President Bush being worse than a Hitler is, as if the kids are told what Hitler was. They say Hitler was a right-winger who must reflect the beliefs of awful conservatives who support America. Truth, ignored in favor of indoctrination, creates community-adjusted people. In spite of the evidence that they are more likely to be anti-social, the teachers press on with the same John Dewey beliefs of turning out communal citizens.

America differs from every other nation in the world. American’s freedoms produced a lot of prosperity and happiness, something never experienced on a grand scale before. America has 5% of the world’s population and controls over 20% of its wealth. Americans live differently than others in the world. Even the poorest American is wealthy when compared to the rest of the world’s poor. Should not the reasons for this be a matter of inquiry in the American school system? Instead of teaching American history, teachers give the children their biases of an evil nation among so many better ones. American children, deprived of the legacy of America, may never discover why being free is better than being a slave.

Frontier Americans insisted on schooling children. Communities of Americans erected schools and hired teachers to provide the skills children would need to grow and better themselves, such as reading, numbers and measurements, morality, geography, sciences, observing and writing. Teachers helped them define and pursue their interests and aspirations, and to refine their skills and talents with each step they took in life. Learning how not to be crippled by unreasonable, passionate biases, they set their own courses in life. In the quest to destroy our nation, the school system was the first infiltrated by those antagonistic to Americas founding principles.

Children were coming out of early American schools in hot pursuit of their legitimate self-interests, which resulted in winners and prosperity through freedom, as well as losers who had to try again. Individual prosperity resulted in prosperous families, whose prosperity spilled into their communities, whose communities, together, produced a prosperous nation. People made themselves different by their individual efforts and choices. This is what the community-oriented leftists had to destroy. The anthill mentality was unknown in America. They would change this.

The education establishment in America today has been successful in changing the direction young Americans now travel. They become the troops defending an imposed prescription for well-adjusted communities. Children are taught to be the best of the worst and the worst of the best, or mediocre. Their madrassas are achieving what no outside conquering armies could ever do to the United States of America.

[Phyxius]

*Yawn*

You really need to find some new material... http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a176/Hasatude5150/beatinoff.gif

[AnnEsthesia]

We get it. You feel the liberal democratic left are to blame for every ill that is, has been or will ever be. You are wrong, but could you at least attempt a new song with that supposedly open mind of yours?

[ClayBarham]

Ah, shucks, I'll bet you say that to all conservatives.

[piratemonkey]

You think that posting opinion-filled essays with not a shred of evidence of any kind in them. Do you think that strategy is going to convince anyone that your viewpoint is correct?

E.g. Show us, with factual evidence that:

At best, the skill training Muslim children receive is more on how to make a bomb to murder infidels...

You are claiming that bomb-making is something that is common in madrassas. I really don't like the idea of fundamentalist religious schooling, but that doesn't mean that they are all teaching kids to "make a bomb."

Do you have any evidence that this is common?

I bet not.

And that's just the first unsubstantiated claim that you make here... there are scores more.

[ClayBarham]

Are you really a liberal? Show me evidence of that. I need proof, otherwise, how can I read your stuff and make a decision on its value?

[Red Dragon]

Muslim schools, known as madrassas, teach Muslim viewpoints on just about everything in the world. Actually Madrasah is just the Arabic word for school. Although for some reason it has become common in the english language to use it to refer to an Islamic religious school. But then again I'm not surprised that American's have such a horrible understanding of this word, when they don't even use Liberal in the correct term most of the time. There is always a viewpoint. At best, the skill training Muslim children receive is more on how to make a bomb to murder infidels and receive a death reward in Paradise of 72 virgins to molest. Wow seeing as that's a rather popular misconception about Islam. I doubt any Islamic school would be teaching that to children and lets not forget the fact that suicide and the killing of innocents is sinfull to Muslims. Also, the believers who make it into Paradise, male and female, are promised beautiful companions, known as "Houris" in Arabic. The Quran describes them in some detail as such:

"Serving [the believers] will be immortal youths with jeweled and crystal cups filled with the purest wine which will neither give them headache nor hangover, with fruits and meats of their desire. They will be fair ones with lovely intense eyes like guarded pearls; A reward for the good deeds of their past life." (56:17-24)
"We have created mates for them and made them virgins, matched in age, for the companions of the right hand." (56:35-38)

"They will be chaste, restraining their eyes in modesty, never touched by man or Jinn."(55:56)

"Serving them will be immortal servants. When you see them, they will look like scattered pearls." (76:19)

The Islamic scholar Yusuf Ali defines the word "Houris" in his english interpretation of Qur'an as "Youths of perpetual freshness." He also described them in his commentary: "The companionship of Beauty and Grace is one of the highest pleasures of life. In this bodily life it takes bodily form. In the higher life it takes a higher form...The pronoun in Arabic is in the feminine gender. It is made clear that these maidens for heavenly society will be of special creation,-of virginal purity, grace, and beauty, inspiring and inspired by love, with the question of time and age eliminated." Also women aren't left out: A man in paradise will get numerous female servants for himself, while a woman would get male servants. The Quran says that women shall be compensated just as well and says about the believers that "they" (the gender unspecified) shall have perfected mates/spouses as a reward of their deeds (2:25, 3:15, 4:57). So women will get the man of their dreams. Actually, even better than you could dream of.




Improving their minds, to think more than feel, to sharpen their skills and talents, and achieve what they personally aspire to achieve, are never taught. Wow that's a pretty big collective calim to make there, do you have evidence to back it up?

Those things isolate each child as an individual, not a member of the Muslim anthill. Again with the Muslim hivemind, don't you ever get tired of that collectivist propaganda. They learn to accept and believe in what the mullahs, ayatollahs, sheiks, imams and teachers preach repeatedly, that non-Muslims are to be murdered along with those who stray from their narrow path. Really I did some digging and found some things in the Qu'ran that disagrrees. "Fight in the cause of God against those who fight you, but do not transgress limits. God does not love transgressors." (Quran 2:190)

"And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for God. But if they desist, then let there be no hostility except against wrongdoers." (Quran 2:193)

"If they seek peace, then you seek peace. And trust in God for He is the One that hears and knows all things." (Quran 8:61)

"There is no compulsion in religion". (2:256)



In America, the K-12 schools are the madrassas of the American left. American children are taught their nation is bad in just about every respect. There are no redeeming qualities to America or Americans. Really because I attend a public school and while it is a monoply, I have never head any anti-American sentiment.

Americans pay for them to learn this, of course. The children are taught to follow their feelings, feelings encouraged by teachers who are taught to hate individual self-interests and favor community interests they define. Skills, which, when taught and learned, may be assimilated differently by each student reflecting his or her interests, are avoided. Individual excellence is discouraged in favor of group excellence. Children who exhibit high intellectual development are labeled mentally troubled and handicapped. You know if any of this is true it proably has more to do with the schools being directly run by the state, rather then the leaders of the state.

Teachers tell their students that capitalism is an economic system at odds with humanity and America is the most violent and corrupt nation on earth. Really because I've grown up hearing from my teachers that America is the greatest country, or at least one of the greatests. Teachers tell their children about President Bush being worse than a Hitler is, as if the kids are told what Hitler was. The only person in any public education building I've been in who was spoken in a worse manner then Hitler was Stalin, and that is most likely because he killed more people.

They say Hitler was a right-winger who must reflect the beliefs of awful conservatives who support America. Actually The American Conservative movment does have some things in common with the Neo-Nazi Nitwits. One is the focus on the family and it's impact on society. Something you share with Hitler is the fact you and him are extremly focused on the greatness of the family, and it's impact on society. Also that and political nationalism, economic nationalism, and small amounts of militarism are found in both the conservative and Nazi movement. Truth, ignored in favor of indoctrination, creates community-adjusted people. In spite of the evidence that they are more likely to be anti-social, the teachers press on with the same John Dewey beliefs of turning out communal citizens. Only individuals can act, not groups or societies. Only individuals can think and reason and make value-judgments. So we always have to start from the premise of individual value expression. The facts of morality have nothing to do with religion, politics, group consensus, tradition, what your friends say, or what your teacher said in public school. They are about finding out for yourself how you can act in accordance with reality and live a happy, fulfilled life.


America differs from every other nation in the world. American’s freedoms produced a lot of prosperity and happiness, something never experienced on a grand scale before. America has 5% of the world’s population and controls over 20% of its wealth. Americans live differently than others in the world. Even the poorest American is wealthy when compared to the rest of the world’s poor. Your point we still live under the monopoly of the state, and what good is the market if it is only a state market?

Should not the reasons for this be a matter of inquiry in the American school system? Instead of teaching American history, teachers give the children their biases of an evil nation among so many better ones. American children, deprived of the legacy of America, may never discover why being free is better than being a slave. Well you know Caly I don't think the any State is potrayed as evil as it truly is. I mean should not people have more introduction to the jeffersonian maxim that "the best government is that which governs least". And more importantly should not people know that anarchism is the extension of that principle to its logical conclusion -- that the government which governs least is no government at all. I mean truly what value does the state add to Humans?


Frontier Americans insisted on schooling children. Communities of Americans erected schools and hired teachers to provide the skills children would need to grow and better themselves, such as reading, numbers and measurements, morality, geography, sciences, observing and writing. Teachers helped them define and pursue their interests and aspirations, and to refine their skills and talents with each step they took in life. Learning how not to be crippled by unreasonable, passionate biases, they set their own courses in life. In the quest to destroy our nation, the school system was the first infiltrated by those antagonistic to Americas founding principles.

Children were coming out of early American schools in hot pursuit of their legitimate self-interests, which resulted in winners and prosperity through freedom, as well as losers who had to try again. Individual prosperity resulted in prosperous families, whose prosperity spilled into their communities, whose communities, together, produced a prosperous nation. People made themselves different by their individual efforts and choices. This is what the community-oriented leftists had to destroy. The anthill mentality was unknown in America. They would change this. Actually collectivism has been around in America since Humans first came to this area of land. The State and the collective has been represing the individdual for all if not most of human history. There has been not been one American who has truly been free.

The education establishment in America today has been successful in changing the direction young Americans now travel. They become the troops defending an imposed prescription for well-adjusted communities. Children are taught to be the best of the worst and the worst of the best, or mediocre. Their madrassas are achieving what no outside conquering armies could ever do to the United States of America.
You expect people who live in a Tryany of the Majority and yet deny and choke it up as part of the common good. How can people be intelligent and yet fall prey to this vulgar utilitarian view.

[Elrathin]

Are you really a liberal? Show me evidence of that. I need proof, otherwise, how can I read your stuff and make a decision on its value?


You need someone to say whether they are a liberal or not to respond to their writings?

[lily]

Clay........I think you've just been pwned by a 15 year old!

Good job, Red...........full of facts.

[firefox]

Two words: Christian Fundamentalism. They have schools too, you know! Also, what evidence is there that liberals actually hate everything America stands for, etc? I've never heard any make such statements. What you say about economics in government schools is true. After all, the state has a vested interest in creating dependency don't you think?

[ClayBarham]

Well, that's all and good for the Quran, but how do the Mullahs, Aystollahs and Imams claim it to mean, as they are calling the shots, not the Quran. As to Christian Fundamentalists, I have yet to hear of them teaching that Jews and Muslims are dogs worthy only of being killed. Is that in the Bible?

[Red Dragon]

So I can make general blanket statements about Americans, Iranians, Russians, Canadians, ECT, because I disagree with the government that rules them and their government calls the shots? Also Mullah is a title given to some Islamic clergy, coming from the Arabic word mawla, meaning both 'vicar' and 'guardian.' Depending on the circumstances it can be either a term of respect (a learned man) or abuse (a bigot and fanatic). The title is commonly given to local Islamic clerics or mosque leaders. The term is seldom used in Arabic-speaking areas, where its nearest equivalent is shaykh (implying formal Islamic training), imam (prayer leader; not to be confused with the Imams of the Shiite world), or `ālim (plural `ūlamā') (scholar; see ulema). In the Sunni world, the concept of "cleric" is of limited usefulness, as authority in the religious system is relatively decentralized. Something I applaud them for, seeing as centralized theocratic authority does tend to lead to a corruption of some kind. Now the Shi'a believe that an Imam is someone who is able to lead mankind in all aspects of life. In addition, Shi'a believe that an Imam is a perfect example in everything. According to the Shi'a, an Imam is a leader who must be followed since he is appointed by Allah (God). Muhammad informed that the number of Imams after him would be twelve, as the compilers of Sahih Hadith have narrated it. The Sunni sect does not have imams in the same sense as the Shi'a sect. The imam in the Sunni sect of Islam is the leader of prayers; the Sheikh most often gives the sermon. However, there are some people whom Sunnis call "Imams" who are not prayer leaders. They are not Imams in the Shi'a sense of the word, but they are those who started the four Sunni Madhabs. As for the fact that you seem ignorant of Christian terrorism I'm going to tell you that you should seek out the National Liberation Front of Tripura. Now whether the Bible actually supports these actions is not really important as only what a small number of Christians with titles and theocratic duties are important. Especially the loud vocal ones who distort the original message and violate the non-aggression policy. Or at least that's the claim you made with Islam. A salute to collectivism, a salute to ignorance!

[jafar00]

Well, that's all and good for the Quran, but how do the Mullahs, Aystollahs and Imams claim it to mean, as they are calling the shots, not the Quran. As to Christian Fundamentalists, I have yet to hear of them teaching that Jews and Muslims are dogs worthy only of being killed. Is that in the Bible?


I'd really like you to provide some proof from Islamic texts to back up these outrageous claims (72 virgins etc) that you make. Basically, put up or shut up. :p

[Pookie]

I've figured out two things from Clay's rather long-winded post:

1. The schools I went to obviously were not here in America. I could have sworn I was educated here, but apparently I was mistaken because the schools I attended did teach individuality, no teachers ever said the President was good or bad, and I was always encouraged to be the best I could be. Now I just have to figure out where the hell I did go to school. This won't look good on a resume.

2. Muslim countries must be total bores if you can find THAT many virgins for each man. How do they explain children if they don't believe in immaculate conceptions? And most men can barely handle ONE woman. What kind of heaven will it be if all those 72 virgins go on the rag at the same time and PMS all over the place? Sorry, that sounds more like hell to me, and I'm a female.

Purrs,
Pookie

[AlanC]

I've figured out two things from Clay's rather long-winded post:

1. The schools I went to obviously were not here in America. I could have sworn I was educated here, but apparently I was mistaken because the schools I attended did teach individuality, no teachers ever said the President was good or bad, and I was always encouraged to be the best I could be. Now I just have to figure out where the hell I did go to school. This won't look good on a resume.

2. Muslim countries must be total bores if you can find THAT many virgins for each man. How do they explain children if they don't believe in immaculate conceptions? And most men can barely handle ONE woman. What kind of heaven will it be if all those 72 virgins go on the rag at the same time and PMS all over the place? Sorry, that sounds more like hell to me, and I'm a female.

Purrs,
Pookie


Now I just had to smile at this. Thanks Pookie.

[I Like Beer]

Clay........I think you've just been pwned by a 15 year old!

Good job, Red...........full of facts.


I wish to add my congratulations to your post too, Red. Nice, thorough job.

:clapper::clapper::clapper:

I put Clay on my ignore list so I can't read what he's posted, but I can sure guess at it. :)

[ClayBarham]

So, we are led to believe, by the posts on this page, that the Muslim schools do not teach their religion is best, and those non-believers should be eliminated or put in their place, that the Twin Towers were brought down by Bush and Cheney, that America is a sewer, and on and on. Reminds me of the people who stood on top of the skyscraper in the movie Independence Day to welcome the folks from space, who then were all blown up. Hmmmm, is that like the ostrich in denial? Well, you'll have to excuse me, as there doesn't seem like many who stand up for America and what was created in America when compared to the rest of the world, so I guess I'll do it.

[Red Dragon]

You have not even proved that individuals teaching at such schools even prescribe to a school of thought that relies on violence. So how did you even come to that outlandish claim of yours? Also when did I ever claim in this thread that 9/11 was conspiracy? Or that America was a sewer, although I do hold that the American government is a monopoly as it has a secure income from its citizens and does not need to improve. But all governments are monopolies so nothing can really be done about them except for maybe removing them, but I'm getting off track aren't I? Hmm now you make a reference to the 49th best sci-fi movie of all time. You say that we deluded for not believing in your collectivist propaganda, and that we are in denial of a Muslim hive mind. Also what exactly are you standing up for Clay collectivism, the government monopoly, or is it some other type of myth that you’re defending?

[Pookie]

What in the name of God are you talking about?
American schools DO NOT give in to bullpoo. Get that!
Clay, did you not read my post? I SAID that I was brought up differently in American schools that helped me find my OWN individualism. Yes, I made a joke of it and you did not get it. Shame on you!!
The damn twin towers WERE NOT brought down by Bush and Cheney. Where in the hell did you find that lie?
Or are you taunting us? Hah. That won't work.
And there is a strong American group presence here in this forum. All of us, no matter what, believe our country is the greatest and yes, although we disagree on minor points about certain issues, we come together BECAUSE WE ARE AMERICANS!!
Now stick that damn idea in your pipe and smoke it. To hell with you and everyone else who LIES!
Hisses,
Pookie
PS. Let's make a bet I get a neg rep from him for this one LOL!!

[piratemonkey]

Are you really a liberal? Show me evidence of that. I need proof, otherwise, how can I read your stuff and make a decision on its value?


You need someone to say whether they are a liberal or not to respond to their writings?


I think he's making an assertion... that I haven't shown evidence to back up my claims that I'm a "liberal" as is posted in my personal information.

What he fails to understand is that this isn't the topic of the thread... and that when he starts thread, we're allowed to ask him to document the claims he made on this topic.

Something he never does.
:rolleyes:

[ClayBarham]

If I were to say, "It's a beautiful day today," many on this blog will insist that I prove it, show my sources and links, making a point that if I cannot or will not do that, my view of todays weather is not valid. Then, if I do cite a source, the same ones will come back and insist they are not acceptable to them, and on and on. I do not waste my time on that. Instead, for those who come back and suggest my views are not real, or express why they disagree, I will involve myself in the debate. Life's too short to waste any of it on those whose minds are so locked up they cannot step out and simply say why they disagree. Again, it's as Augustine said, "Belief precedes understanding," and if the belief is not able to be challenged, then why waste time? My one issue has always been that individual legitimate self-interests are superior to community interests, because the latter are defined by those who lead community. Argue these points and I'll jump in, but you'll need to use your own thinking and cite some reference as part of it, not the be all and end all.

[Elrathin]

If I were to say, "It's a beautiful day today," many on this blog will insist that I prove it, show my sources and links, making a point that if I cannot or will not do that, my view of todays weather is not valid.

That's because in that context you are not stating it as an opinion, but as a fact. Instead if you were to say you think it is a beautiful day, noone can argue your stance.

That is your problem Clay, you state things as FACTS, when really they are just opinions.


My one issue has always been that individual legitimate self-interests are superior to community interests, because the latter are defined by those who lead community. Argue these points and I'll jump in, but you'll need to use your own thinking and cite some reference as part of it, not the be all and end all.


And it has already been proven you are not FOR individual self interests over community, you are FOR CONSERVATIVE self-interests over the community.

[December]

Our American Madrassas

ClayBarham, when did it become popular in US to criminalize the Muslim people?
In 2001?

What is the deal here?

Islamic Circle of North America
http://www.icna.org/icna/index.php

Also -
http://www.islamicsupremecouncil.org