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suedanim
11-05-2007, 03:48 PM
We need new leadership in both the Senate and the House! jeezus what is wrong with Democrats today? Can we not find ANY with strong commitment to ending this insane occupation of Iraq?

It appears too that Hillary Clinton will likely continue similar policy on Iraq and surely if Cheney attacks Iran before she takes office, we will be dealing with wars in 3/4 countries simultaneously. The American people should be screaming about this. Seriously.

'Blank check' seen headed Bush's way, despite Democratic promises to change course in Iraq (http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Blank_check_seen_headed_Bushs_way_1105.html)

Nick Juliano

Published: Monday November 5, 2007


Democratic leaders in Congress are quietly preparing to give President Bush essentially everything he wants to keep the Iraq war going for at least another six months without forcing any change in course.

Swept into power on the votes of war-weary Americans last year, Congressional Democrats have so far failed in all their attempts to curtail Bush's war efforts. As they consider the president's latest request for $200 billion in supplementary war funding party leaders have pledged not to hand over another "blank check."

But, as Roll Call reports, a "blank check" is exactly what appears headed for the Pentagon.

"Democratic leaders continue to fear GOP attacks that cutting off or slowing funds would hurt the troops, despite anger among the Democratic base over the party’s failure to use Congress’ power of the purse to end the war," reports the Capitol Hill newspaper's Steven T. Dennis.

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) and Appropriations Committee Chairman David Obey (D-WI) have said they won't consider a supplemental funding bill that doesn't include timelines for troop withdrawals. But, Dennis reports, "Democrats are quietly preparing to give the president enough spending flexibility to keep the war going anyway," for as long as six more months.

As adamant as they say they are about tying war funding to deescalation timetables, Democratic leaders appear even more firmly against an overall cut-off of war funds, which critics say may be their only recourse to actually effect a draw-down of troops from Iraq.

"Sure we have the power on anything to stop the money ... but the thing we have to do is make sure we do it the right way," Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid said on a liberal radio show last month. "It's not a question of all or nothing; it's a question of making sure we do the right thing."

Congress approved billions in extra funding and stopgap spending resolutions after Gen. David Petraeus' testimony on Capitol Hill in September. Next up is the regular Defense spending bill, which Democrats are crafting to allow funding to be diverted from regular Pentagon accounts to fund the war, according to Roll Call. Appropriations Chairman John Murtha (D-PA) told the paper that the Defense Department would be able to maintain the war "until May or June" with the extra flexibility.

In the Senate, an aide told the paper that leaders are considering "short bursts" of war funding as Democrats continue to try to persuade war-weary Republicans to break with the president and support course-changing legislation.

Democrats acknowledge frustration among voters, especially the party's liberal base that has long been calling for an end to America's adventure in Iraq. Pelosi acknowledged the frustration and said she too was frustrated at the lack of progress toward ending the war.

Whether Democrats will be able to reverse the tide depends on their ability to re-frame the debate and stand firm against funding for anything except redeployment, an aide to a Democratic member of the Out of Iraq Caucus told the paper.

"As long as leadership is not willing to challenge the way the president is hiding behind the troops," the aide said, "they're going to continue to get rolled."

Wndrtch
11-05-2007, 03:59 PM
We need new leadership in both the Senate and the House! jeezus what is wrong with Democrats today? Can we not find ANY with strong commitment to ending this insane occupation of Iraq?

It appears too that Hillary Clinton will likely continue similar policy on Iraq and surely if Cheney attacks Iran before she takes office, we will be dealing with wars in 3/4 countries simultaneously. The American people should be screaming about this. Seriously.

'Blank check' seen headed Bush's way, despite Democratic promises to change course in Iraq (http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Blank_check_seen_headed_Bushs_way_1105.html)

Nick Juliano

Published: Monday November 5, 2007


Democratic leaders in Congress are quietly preparing to give President Bush essentially everything he wants to keep the Iraq war going for at least another six months without forcing any change in course.

Swept into power on the votes of war-weary Americans last year, Congressional Democrats have so far failed in all their attempts to curtail Bush's war efforts. As they consider the president's latest request for $200 billion in supplementary war funding party leaders have pledged not to hand over another "blank check."

But, as Roll Call reports, a "blank check" is exactly what appears headed for the Pentagon.

"Democratic leaders continue to fear GOP attacks that cutting off or slowing funds would hurt the troops, despite anger among the Democratic base over the party’s failure to use Congress’ power of the purse to end the war," reports the Capitol Hill newspaper's Steven T. Dennis.

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) and Appropriations Committee Chairman David Obey (D-WI) have said they won't consider a supplemental funding bill that doesn't include timelines for troop withdrawals. But, Dennis reports, "Democrats are quietly preparing to give the president enough spending flexibility to keep the war going anyway," for as long as six more months.

As adamant as they say they are about tying war funding to deescalation timetables, Democratic leaders appear even more firmly against an overall cut-off of war funds, which critics say may be their only recourse to actually effect a draw-down of troops from Iraq.

"Sure we have the power on anything to stop the money ... but the thing we have to do is make sure we do it the right way," Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid said on a liberal radio show last month. "It's not a question of all or nothing; it's a question of making sure we do the right thing."

Congress approved billions in extra funding and stopgap spending resolutions after Gen. David Petraeus' testimony on Capitol Hill in September. Next up is the regular Defense spending bill, which Democrats are crafting to allow funding to be diverted from regular Pentagon accounts to fund the war, according to Roll Call. Appropriations Chairman John Murtha (D-PA) told the paper that the Defense Department would be able to maintain the war "until May or June" with the extra flexibility.

In the Senate, an aide told the paper that leaders are considering "short bursts" of war funding as Democrats continue to try to persuade war-weary Republicans to break with the president and support course-changing legislation.

Democrats acknowledge frustration among voters, especially the party's liberal base that has long been calling for an end to America's adventure in Iraq. Pelosi acknowledged the frustration and said she too was frustrated at the lack of progress toward ending the war.

Whether Democrats will be able to reverse the tide depends on their ability to re-frame the debate and stand firm against funding for anything except redeployment, an aide to a Democratic member of the Out of Iraq Caucus told the paper.

"As long as leadership is not willing to challenge the way the president is hiding behind the troops," the aide said, "they're going to continue to get rolled."



Suckers!!

:madlaugh:

PatrickHenry
11-05-2007, 04:37 PM
9/11 don't you see... (http://globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=7251)

suedanim
11-05-2007, 05:09 PM
9/11 don't you see... (http://globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=7251)


I listened to that speech and couldn't believe it. I thought for a second I was back in 2004 and listening to the constant fearmongering they capitalized on then.

Bush’s address was less a speech than a semi-hysterical diatribe, combining scare-mongering, crackpot history and bullying of his opponents in Washington. As in all presidential speeches of the past several years, he spoke before a carefully vetted audience at the Heritage Foundation, one of the main right-wing think tanks.

I thought this as he spoke... geez and damn! Is America so shallow, so defeated they are going to let these evil men continue to get away with this farce?

Its maddening that Americans and worse, elected representatives are falling for this ridiculous replay, this scripted, bad acting this WH has used again and again and again. Why is it working to intimidate Democrats? I don't get it.

bobbylien
11-05-2007, 05:19 PM
What do you want the change of course to be Sue?

PatrickHenry
11-05-2007, 05:21 PM
Sue...you need some cynicism.

Politics is an elitist game and while the Dems and Republicans trade offices, they won't allow real democracy to occur.

It would upset the applecart...

Wndrtch
11-05-2007, 05:46 PM
I thought this as he spoke... geez and damn! Is America so shallow, so defeated they are going to let these evil men continue to get away with this farce?

Its maddening that Americans and worse, elected representatives are falling for this ridiculous replay, this scripted, bad acting this WH has used again and again and again. Why is it working to intimidate Democrats? I don't get it.


Because deep down, they KNOW America has to stay engaged in the Middle East, if they want any hope of preventing the next mass-casualty attack. Otherwise, they would just cut funding, drive up the casualties, and declair victory for defeatism.

Then, they can officialy change the DNC mascott to:

http://www.webweaver.nu/clipart/img/nature/birds/ostrich.jpg

suedanim
11-05-2007, 06:15 PM
Well I won't get what I want. I'd like to see a clean sweep of Congress. Out with the old, with a few exceptions, and in with many new faces.

I don't want to see Hillary Clinton elected if its going to mean a continuation of the Bush wars.

I want a strong diplomacy, a strong and central State department and a defense department that has nothing to do with foreign policy. It'd be nice to have an executive that actually listens to and takes the advice of senior military commanders and Generals, rather than one that picks those who will sign on to what the executive WANTS to hear or demands.

I've opposed this war since the first rhetoric from this WH began in 2002 against Iraq and have been very outspoken about it. Their game plan and accompanying rhetoric have not changed.

btw...the war in Iraq HAD nothing at all to do with 9/11 AND in addition, if our illegal surveillance and torture is so effective, as is claimed, there should be very little concern for maintaining war in Iraq, escalating it to include Iran and a high military presence in the Middle East.

We cannot maintain this level of aggression. It has to end and soon.

Wndrtch
11-05-2007, 10:14 PM
Well I won't get what I want. I'd like to see a clean sweep of Congress. Out with the old, with a few exceptions, and in with many new faces.

On this, I can agree with you. Out with the old, in with the new x2.

I want a strong diplomacy, a strong and central State department and a defense department that has nothing to do with foreign policy.

Um, the Military is PART of a strong diplomacy. Without it, diplomacy is just a fancy debate society, and will get nothing significant accomplished. How else, do you convince a bad guy, not to be bad? Just ask? I don't think so.

btw...the war in Iraq HAD nothing at all to do with 9/11

And Bush never said it did. He said we were going to be pro-active and agressive about preventing the NEXT 911 attack. If you are going to do that, then you can't ignore that Global Jihad comes out of and is supported within the Middle East nations. It is the "Head-of-the-Snake" so to speak. Therefore, our military was destined to be deployed to the Middle East somewhere. Well, the most central boarder nation in the Middle East, is Iraq. It boarders Iran, Syria, and Saudi Arabia. As a bonus, on the other side of Iran, you have Afghanistan (Gee Wally, will ya look at that! American Forces have Iran boxed in on both its Eastern and Western boarder! We can attack from either side if we want, with out bothering the do-nothing UN!). Seems rather obvious why we went to Iraq.

AND in addition, if our illegal surveillance and torture is so effective, as is claimed, there should be very little concern for maintaining war in Iraq, escalating it to include Iran and a high military presence in the Middle East.

"Knowing" something is going to happen is useless, if you don't DO anything with the information. Action is where things happen, not just talking about it. Like my signature line says, "Do SOMETHING, even if it's right!"

We cannot maintain this level of aggression. It has to end and soon.

Fine, then go and convince the terrorist to behave, and stop killing kids in malls. Seeing how you know all the mistakes we have made over the decades, and have all the answers, it should be a cake-walk for you. Just let us know who your next-of-kin is, before you go there.

Interrested
11-05-2007, 11:35 PM
Personally, based on what I've seen Hillary is saying a lot of what people want to hear. She may be completely against this war, but does not wish to upset either her financial backers, party leaders, or the voters in general. She has to be careful of what she says until the primary is over, then she can come out with her real opinions.

lily
11-06-2007, 02:42 AM
Well.......I know how my senators are going to vote on this.....I'm keeping an eye on the presidentian nominees, that's for sure.

Anti-Racism
11-06-2007, 04:12 AM
Are you saying democracy is a farce because too many special issues manipulate the electorate?

Holy wide stance, Batman, you're sounding like Plato.