Petition From Duncan Hunter To Get The Border Fence Built That Congrees Passed.......

[nevadamedic]

"It’s all too obvious that America is under threat because its land borders are largely porous and unprotected. In response, last year Congress passed, and the President signed into law, legislation calling for the construction of 854 miles of border fencing along the U.S.-Mexico border. Despite this legislative mandate by the U.S. Congress, the Department of Homeland Security recently announced its intention to build only 370 miles of fencing along the border, not the 854 miles required by the legislation. The Kennedy-McCain Amnesty bill, also would cut the 854 miles of fence down to 370.

I wrote the border fence bill and it is not ambiguous. It is not a suggestion. It was passed and signed by the President. It is the law. It has been over six months since we passed that law and only 11 miles have been built. At that rate, it will take us 20 years to build it. If elected President, I will build all 854 miles in six months. In the meantime, it is still the law and the fact that only 11 miles have been built is unacceptable." - Congressman Duncan Hunter

http://www.gohunter08.com/petition/

Everyone should sign this Petition. This is a bill the President signed and made a law. We need to get a fence up for our protection and National Security reasons. This has nothing to do with Republican's or Democrat's or even the deportation of illegal's, or even supporting Duncan Hunter, it has to do with the protection of our country.

[Elrathin]

A fence is nothing but a waste of money. If you want to post the guard, fine, but a fence is just plain stupid.

[BoogyMan]

El, you might find it stupid, but I would imagine that to be a statement of opinion rather than fact. Are there downsides to building such a barrier? Certainly. Are there discernable examples of a functional fence for protection? Certainly. There are positives and negatives that a simple "fences are stupid" line of argumentation does not allow for the discussion of.

Consider the commentary in this Slate article: Link (http://www.slate.com/id/2143104/)

[ViolaLee]

I find a fence stupid too.

Some leader from another country will one day say to us, Mr (or Mrs) President, TEAR DOWN THAT WALL!

lol!

Really though, a fence is a waste of money. Just stop the employers from hiring illegals. Problem solved.

[BoogyMan]

I find a fence stupid too.

Some leader from another country will one day say to us, Mr (or Mrs) President, TEAR DOWN THAT WALL!

lol!

Really though, a fence is a waste of money. Just stop the employers from hiring illegals. Problem solved.


Prove it Viola. I hear people say things like "a fence is a waste of money" all the time, bit nobody has been able to take it beyond opinion so far.

[Elrathin]

El, you might find it stupid, but I would imagine that to be a statement of opinion rather than fact. Are there downsides to building such a barrier? Certainly. Are there discernable examples of a functional fence for protection? Certainly. There are positives and negatives that a simple "fences are stupid" line of argumentation does not allow for the discussion of.

Consider the commentary in this Slate article: Link (http://www.slate.com/id/2143104/)


Boogy, get me a pair of wire snips and the fence is gone. HOw much money are you willing to pay in taxes to constantly fix holes in the fence that come about?

As I said, the fence idea is stupid. If you don't like my opinion, tough, I will do everything I can to fight a fence being built. It is a waste of money that we simply just can't afford to waste on a fence.

Unless you plan to make the whole thing out of brick or cement, which would e expensive as hell, then a chainsaw, wire snips, etc make that fence useless and costly to upkeep.

[BoogyMan]

El, you might find it stupid, but I would imagine that to be a statement of opinion rather than fact. Are there downsides to building such a barrier? Certainly. Are there discernable examples of a functional fence for protection? Certainly. There are positives and negatives that a simple "fences are stupid" line of argumentation does not allow for the discussion of.

Consider the commentary in this Slate article: Link (http://www.slate.com/id/2143104/)


Boogy, get me a pair of wire snips and the fence is gone. HOw much money are you willing to pay in taxes to constantly fix holes in the fence that come about?

As I said, the fence idea is stupid. If you don't like my opinion, tough, I will do everything I can to fight a fence being built. It is a waste of money that we simply just can't afford to waste on a fence.


I was unaware that wire was the only choice available to us El. As for the tenor of your commentary, how about debating the topic instead of heading into the hostility zone at the first sign someone might possible disagree and ask for substantiation of an opinion.

There are examples of successful barriers out there, there are also examples of failure.

[AlonzoMourning23]

Whatever you do, don't build it like this:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=mj6S9QGm7P4

Smugglers took it down with a blowtorch.

[nevadamedic]

El, you might find it stupid, but I would imagine that to be a statement of opinion rather than fact. Are there downsides to building such a barrier? Certainly. Are there discernable examples of a functional fence for protection? Certainly. There are positives and negatives that a simple "fences are stupid" line of argumentation does not allow for the discussion of.

Consider the commentary in this Slate article: Link (http://www.slate.com/id/2143104/)


Boogy, get me a pair of wire snips and the fence is gone. HOw much money are you willing to pay in taxes to constantly fix holes in the fence that come about?

As I said, the fence idea is stupid. If you don't like my opinion, tough, I will do everything I can to fight a fence being built. It is a waste of money that we simply just can't afford to waste on a fence.

Unless you plan to make the whole thing out of brick or cement, which would e expensive as hell, then a chainsaw, wire snips, etc make that fence useless and costly to upkeep.


Fight it all you want, it will do no good. Your Democratic controlled Congress passed this bill and the President signed it into law.

It needs to be done. It has already reduced crossings where it is built now, it is showing results. Obviously you know nothing about border security.

[Elrathin]

Obviously you know nothing about border security.


I know enough to know that it won't do any good. Mark my words, if it is built I can't wait to start linking all the holes that will be found.

[ViolaLee]

I find a fence stupid too.

Some leader from another country will one day say to us, Mr (or Mrs) President, TEAR DOWN THAT WALL!

lol!

Really though, a fence is a waste of money. Just stop the employers from hiring illegals. Problem solved.


Prove it Viola. I hear people say things like "a fence is a waste of money" all the time, bit nobody has been able to take it beyond opinion so far.
People climb over fences. People dig under fences. People cut through fences.

Spend the money enforcing the laws we already have against hiring illegal immigrants. Problem solved. A fence is a waste of money if the jobs are still here for illegals. If there is a job for a desperate person, that person will find a way to get here. A fence is a waste of money.

[BoogyMan]

Obviously you know nothing about border security.


I know enough to know that it won't do any good. Mark my words, if it is built I can't wait to start linking all the holes that will be found.


If it is built and is shown to be having some positive effects, would you link those as well Elrathin?

[ViolaLee]

Did you watch Alonzo's video?

[BoogyMan]

I find a fence stupid too.

Some leader from another country will one day say to us, Mr (or Mrs) President, TEAR DOWN THAT WALL!

lol!

Really though, a fence is a waste of money. Just stop the employers from hiring illegals. Problem solved.


Prove it Viola. I hear people say things like "a fence is a waste of money" all the time, bit nobody has been able to take it beyond opinion so far.
People climb over fences. People dig under fences. People cut through fences.

Spend the money enforcing the laws we already have against hiring illegal immigrants. Problem solved. A fence is a waste of money if the jobs are still here for illegals. If there is a job for a desperate person, that person will find a way to get here. A fence is a waste of money.


Yet, you still don't provide anything concrete Viola. Yes, people evade an obstacle, but why do you refuse to recognize the fact that in areas where barriers have been built, they have also had some positive effects along with the negatives.

With the recent ruling against enforcing our immigration laws I am forced to wonder as to your view of that ruling. Link (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071010/ap_on_bi_ge/immigrant_employers_lawsuit_4)

With open borders judges knowingly disavowing their sworn duty and the emotion based responses to border barriers there is precious little getting done.

[Buck Laser]

Obviously you know nothing about border security.


I know enough to know that it won't do any good. Mark my words, if it is built I can't wait to start linking all the holes that will be found.


If it is built and is shown to be having some positive effects, would you link those as well Elrathin?

Hoping for positive effects from a border fence is IMO stupid. I was born and raised in the lower Rio Grande Valley, where sections of the fence are scheduled to be built. I think everyone in the Valley is against it because it will disrupt the historically porous border, destroy wildlife habitats, cut families off from one another, and waste some of the best land in North America just so some xenophobes in MN and Wichita Falls can feel like something has been done.

I'm hardly an admirer of Rick Perry, Texas Guv, but I heard that he's actually opposed to the fence. Good on him, even if I wouldn't vote for him for nothing.

The people who are so hot to have fences should take a serious tour of the US/Mexico border, then come back and tell us what they think of the idea.

[ViolaLee]

With the recent ruling against enforcing our immigration laws I am forced to wonder as to your view of that ruling. Link (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071010/ap_on_bi_ge/immigrant_employers_lawsuit_4)

With open borders judges knowingly disavowing their sworn duty and the emotion based responses to border barriers there is precious little getting done.
Until the social security dept gets their data base in order, employers can't use the social security data base to deny people a job. There are too many mistakes that would cost legal workers their jobs.

Millions of workers each year get notices from the government that the Social Security numbers and names they use for their jobs don't match government records. Often it's a mistake.

Former immigration commissioner Doris Meissner says that a worker might have put the wrong number on their job application.

"The employer may have made an error in transmitting the number to the government," she says. "The number and the name may not be connected in the government's records because the person got married and forgot to send in a change of name."

"Frankly, a lot of employers are going to play it safe and fire these employees," says Randy Johnson, who handles immigration issues at the U.S. Chamber of Commerce. He says that even an allowance of a couple of months or so to resolve mistakes might not prevent what he calls "collateral" damage.

"You might have some Americans ... and permanent residents who, for example can't explain the discrepancy and they have to go to Social Security to get the records for it, and they can't get it in time," Johnson says. "And the employer might say, 'Well, gee, I can't take the chance of keeping you on my rolls.'"NPR (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=12612074)

Why can't employers just use the I-9 form?

http://www.formi9.com/index.aspx?s=g-2

[BoogyMan]

I am a xenophobe because I support border barriers?

A xenophobe, according to dictionary.com, is one who "a person who fears or hates foreigners, strange customs, etc."

So you are honestly equating a desire to enforce our laws pertaining to immigration with hate and fear?

How ridiculous.

[ViolaLee]

A fence doesn't help a desire to enforce our laws pertaining to immigration.

An employer who asks an employee for the proper papers follows our laws pertaining to immigration.

[BoogyMan]

A fence doesn't help a desire to enforce our laws pertaining to immigration.

Prove it Viola.


An employer who asks an employee for the proper papers follows our laws pertaining to immigration.


I agree.

[Truth_and_Power]

I find a fence stupid too.

Some leader from another country will one day say to us, Mr (or Mrs) President, TEAR DOWN THAT WALL!

lol!

Really though, a fence is a waste of money. Just stop the employers from hiring illegals. Problem solved.


Prove it Viola. I hear people say things like "a fence is a waste of money" all the time, bit nobody has been able to take it beyond opinion so far.
People climb over fences. People dig under fences. People cut through fences.

Spend the money enforcing the laws we already have against hiring illegal immigrants. Problem solved. A fence is a waste of money if the jobs are still here for illegals. If there is a job for a desperate person, that person will find a way to get here. A fence is a waste of money.



I think we have two problems. One, the border is too easy to cross. Two, the border is made easier to cross by rings of human smugglers who are supported by industry because we refuse to enforce the laws against employers. I am not trying to make a global warming analogy here, but it's like building a dyke and then taking other actions (or inaction) that causes the water level to rise, resulting in the dyke failing. If its a problem why not build the dyke AND don't cause the water level to rise, and then maybe the dyke will still be there for what you want it to stop (terrorists..??)