Who Called It? Israeli Commandos Training The Kurds.

[crimzonsol]

CAIRO, December 1, 2005 (IslamOnline.net) - Dozens of former Israeli commandos have been training Kurdish security forces in northern Iraq, supplying them with equipment worth millions of dollars, Yedioth Aharonot newspaper reported Thursday, December 1.

Over the past 18 months, these ex-commandos, who were sent to Iraq by several Israeli corporations, have been training special security units as part of a program organized by the Kurdish authorities, said Israel's top-selling daily.

Operating from a secret desert stronghold dubbed Code Z, the ex-Israeli soldiers, all with elite-unit experience, have been training the Kurds in weapons, self-defense and anti-terror techniques.

The newspaper showed photographs of men it said were Israelis, their faces concealed, training Kurds in the use of weapons at an unknown location and preparing vehicles at an airport.

The New Yorker veteran investigative reporter Seymour Hersh said Israeli intelligence and military operatives were quietly at work in northern Iraq, providing training for Kurdish commando units and running covert operations inside Kurdish areas of Iran and Syria.

Israeli Arms

According to the Israeli daily, Motorola Israel and Magalcom Communications and Computers won contracts with the Kurdish government to the tune of hundreds of millions of US dollars.

As part of the program, the firms have supplied the Kurds with tones of Israeli-manufactured equipment, including dozens of motorcycles and all-terrain vehicles, sniffer dogs, devices for upgrading Kalashnikov rifles, flack jackets, uniforms and helmets.

They have also been involved in the secret construction of a major airport near the northern town of Arbil, known as "Hawler International".

The Israelis entered Iraq through its northern border with Turkey posing as construction engineers and agricultural experts, the paper said.

Yedioth Aharonot added that a company owned by Israeli entrepreneur Shlomi Michaels is in full business partnership with the Kurdish government, providing strategic consultation on economic and security issues.

The company was initially established by former Mossad chief Danny Yatom and Michaels, yet Yatom sold his shares upon his election to the Knesset.

A shroud of secrecy has been imposed on the project for fear the Israelis could be targeted by Iraqi resistance groups.

The Kurds, who make up 15-20 percent of Iraq's population and live mostly along the borders with Iran and Turkey, have enjoyed broad autonomy since the 1991 Gulf War.

Despite assurances from both sides, Turkey has repeatedly raised concerned about the reported presence of Israeli operatives in northern Iraq and their cooperation with the country’s Kurdish community.

Source: http://www.islamonline.net/English/News/2005-12/01/article05.shtml
Well it looks like I was right. The Kurds are turning to Israel for help. Any other perspectives?

[tony mitra]

Actually, this is quite believable and natural. Kurds have four major problems, i.e. they face hostility from the Shia, the Sunni, the Iranians and the Turks. That is also why they are signing away production sharing oil contracts bypassing Baghdad, so that the Americans will have an incentive to stay at least in the Kurdish regions, and will hopefully keep its army to protect them from others, of which primarily the rest of Iraqis and Turkey are the biggest threats.

These Kurds are also the least fanatics or hardcore Muslims. Some of them are far more progressive and inclusive of other views than even an average Christian or a Hindu or a Jew. So them asking help from israel is nothing unusual. It is my guess that the Americans will have facilitated it.

Meanwhile, this is also my guess that Turkey is going to have a local skirmish or a war with Northern Iraq soon, and that this particular flash point has an even chance of pitting Turkish troops against Americans or Israeli soldiers, and would be another diplomatic minefield because Turkey is on one side part of NATO and on the other side progressive Muslim, and that the PKK or the Kurdish separatist groups have been recognized by the US as a terrorist organization (against whom the Turkish forces will likely move, which takes them across the border and into Kurkistan).

To make things worse (or better, depending on your point of view), the Kurds sit on potentially large oil reserves. It has been my observation that oil bearing lands are more a curse to the people than a boon, and I suspect Kurdistan will prove to be no different.

By the way, do you know any Kurdish people? I know quite a few, here in Vancouver. I befriended them because one of them was a taxi driver taking me home from the airport, and I struck up a friendship and ended up meeting with them on occassion. Quite interesting, they are. They ran away from Iraq during the Saddam purges, and some ended up in Canada as refugees.

And don't feel smug about the Israeli commando trainers. They too are human, and prone to burn their ass if they decide to sit on a fire.

My overall comment ? Wait and watch, and don't bet on anything yet.

[attachment=288]
A Turkish military truck carries a tank near the Kurdish border ( from the New York Times)

Cheers.
:)

[crimzonsol]

Tony, you remeber the thread I started on what I think will happen after the US pulls out of Iraq? Well this was one of my main points to signify that a blood bath would begin. I said that the Kurds will ask for help from Israel. My other one would be that Iran and Turkey would try and stop them from starting their own country.

I do not know any Kurdish people. I would like to know some, I would like to know atleast one person from every country in the world, that way I can say "As a matter of fact I do know people from that (insert country name)."

[tony mitra]

That the region will have a bloodbath, or several blood baths for quite a while, is without a question, though I do not recollect your particular thread on it. And this will happen irrespective of if the Americans stay or leave.

Abut Kurds Asking Israel, I do not know, but have spent some silent moments thinking about it all off and on in the last few years.

There is a possibility that the neocons of USA along with the Israeli Govt have hatched some sort of a plan about that region, and had this plan in place for a while, as a partial exit strategy if Iraq could not be held in one piece after they take away Saddam.

Saddam had to go, for various reasons, but the most important of them is that he would not allow western oil interests a penny more than a service contract (with no sharing of oil profits at all).

So, if things fell apart, Kurds were a reasonably safe bet since they could not possibly protect themselves from all these people surrounding them. Moreover, they are the most pro-west and least hard core Muslims out there. They are not even ethnic Arab, which is one reason the Arabs cannot tolerate them.

Iran could be kept at bay by threat. But Turkey was a different issue altogether, and the question of PKK was a hard one to solve.

And this is where, I am only guessing and walking on uncharted territory, a sort of a clandestine deal could have been struck between some of the like minded Kurds (Kurds are not united and there are rival factions with differing views there too), the Turks, the Americans and the Israelis. And the deal is to allow Kurdistan complete independence, creating a sovereign nation. The Turks would scream bloody murder because they might lose a part of their territory, so there has to be hard and bloody bargains here on the territory. But to sweeten the deal, Turkey would get a slice of the oil coming out of Kurdistan. In return, they would allow Kurdistan to continue to pipe their oil export through Turkey to the mediterranean.

And what do the Americans and the Israelis get out of it? Well, the Americans first of all ensure that this oil rich region can have a safe access to western markets, and on top have the western oil companies a major share in it. And the Israelis, my guess is, would be allowed to import this oil at a concession, something they have not been able to do from most any Arab or Persian oil field.

So, hopefully, everyone gets something, and all remain happy, except of course the local man on the street in Kurdistan. I am sure they will see less than a cent or two out of every dollar of oil reaching the market.

There is another name for this kind of game - the game of corporate empires. It has been played in different forms in different regions for a very long time.

Anyhow, this is all my guess. I have doubts if the Kurds and the Turks can be made to reach an agreement easily, but Kurdistan has little choice when you come to think of it. If they cannot pipe their oil through Turkey, they have then a few more options - through Syria, rest of Iraq, or through Iran. I would guess the Kurds would rather make deal with the lesser devil, i.e. Turkey, than any of the others, and hope that the Arab insurgents do not infiltrate into that region and keep blowing up pipes and installations, which is where they might need Israel or American help.

Anyhow, this is only a vague guess from me. No telling what might happen - except for the certainty of a lot of bloodbath in future, starting with Turkey threatening to move into Kurdistan first.

About meeting Kurds and others, thats easy. Have an open minded attitude and an appreciation for other people's cultures, religions and views, and a friendly disposition with a genuine wish to learn from others, and you will find making friends is the easiest thing to do with foreigners. You'll also find yourself broadening your views about the world considerably. Try it, young man, it might even change your life!

Cheers - :)

[crimzonsol]

About meeting Kurds and others, thats easy. Have an open minded attitude and an appreciation for other people's cultures, religions and views, and a friendly disposition with a genuine wish to learn from others, and you will find making friends is the easiest thing to do with foreigners. You'll also find yourself broadening your views about the world considerably. Try it, young man, it might even change your life!

Thanks for the advice Tony, I hope it does, my life is sorta boring ever since I moved to America.

[jafar00]

No wonder the US doesn't want Turkey going in to deal with the terrorists plaguing them. They are being trained by the Israelis.

[tony mitra]

Here is a new twist to the same saga, this time from BBC

Bush warns against Armenia bill

"This resolution is not the right response to these historic mass killings," he said hours before a vote by the House Foreign Affairs Committee.

Such a move, already taken by France's parliament, would do "great harm" to US relations with Turkey, Mr Bush added.
Turkey admits many Armenians died in WWI but denies any genocidal campaign.


http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/42603000/jpg/_42603199_mother_ani_203300.jpg
A German soldier took photos of Armenian deportees at the time


It is highly unusual for the White House to make such a dramatic last-minute intervention in Congressional business, the BBC's Justin Webb reports from Washington.

With the opposition Democrats now in charge in Congress, they could force a vote, dealing a potentially grave blow to the Bush administration's efforts to keep Turkey on side, our correspondent adds.

Turkish indignation
Speaking before Mr Bush, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said the passing of the resolution would be "very problematic" for US policy in the Middle East.

It could, she added, destabilise US efforts in Iraq and Afghanistan because Turkey is a main hub for US military operations in the region.
Even if it passes and is then adopted by the House, the bill will not be binding.

But the BBC's Sarah Rainsford, in Istanbul, says that this will have little impact on the reaction in Turkey.

Ankara has pulled out all the stops to prevent the genocide resolution reaching Congress for a vote, she adds.

Politicians have travelled to Washington to lobby lawmakers, while the country's prime minister and president have both contacted Mr Bush. Turkish President Abdullah Gul warned of "serious problems that will emerge in bilateral relations if the bill is adopted".

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44168000/jpg/_44168667_iraq_ap_203b.jpg
Turkey has seen angry rallies demanding action in Iraq

Border tensions
All this comes on top of mounting anger that the US is not doing enough to counter the Kurdish separatist PKK group, which mounts deadly attacks on Turkey from inside Iraq, our correspondent says.
The Turkish prime minister said the government was preparing a motion seeking approval to launch military action in Iraq, which might go before parliament as soon as Thursday.

Some Turkish analysts believe the passing of the US resolution would make it harder for the Turkish government to resist public pressure to cross the border.

However, the US warned Turkey not to pursue Kurdish rebels into northern Iraq.

"We do not think it would be the best place for troops to go into Iraq from Turkey at this time," White House spokeswoman Dana Perino said.

Armenian pressure
Armenia alleges that up to 1.5 million Armenians were killed in an organised campaign to force them out of what is now eastern Turkey in 1915-17.

That is strongly denied by Turkey, which says that large numbers of both Turks and Armenians were killed in the chaos surrounding World War I and the collapse of the Ottoman Empire when Armenians rose up.

It is still extremely difficult to establish a set of undisputed facts about what happened in eastern Anatolia almost a century ago, the BBC's regional analyst Pam O'Toole says.

But the issue has been kept alive by the powerful Armenian diaspora.
Last year, the lower house of the French parliament declared the killings a genocide.

Ankara argues that there were massacres by both sides at the time but completely rejects the allegation that there was a state policy to kill Armenians.

Some Turks fear if those events are recognised as genocide, that could open the door to claims for compensation or even territory, our analyst says.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/americas/7038095.stm


Now, why would Mr. Bush want to protect Turkey from being blamed for the genocide of Armenians? It is a historical fact, and involved perhaps a million or two people. My guess is, Mr. Bush wants to spare Turkey because of the Kurdistan issue, in which USA has a very big stake. In short, USA needs Turkey right now on account of Kurdistan, and hence they should be spared from being accused of a genocide against Christian Armenians.

Any other views why Turkey should be spared from this?

Cheers
:)[/color]

[Deadshot]

As this picture shows, "the enemy of my enemy is my friend."

http://la.indymedia.org/uploads/2002/12/saddam-rumsfeld.jpg

...so, NO, you're revealation is not suprising.

[crimzonsol]

No wonder the US doesn't want Turkey going in to deal with the terrorists plaguing them. They are being trained by the Israelis.

Too true, but I guess thats what happens in war. Nobody cares about the civilians. Not the terrorists, and not the Army.