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Alonzo
06-03-2007, 03:24 AM
ISLAMABAD: Imam-e-Kaaba Shaikh Abdur Rehman al-Sudais has ardently appealed to the Lal Masjid administration to give up the path it has adopted for the past few months or the enemy would benefit from anarchy and chaos.

"I deeply regret and am surprised over their undertaking," he said while talking to a group of senior journalists at the Punjab House on Saturday. Saudi Ambassador Ali Awadh Asseri was also present on the occasion.

In his brief opening remarks, Asseri said the Muslim Ummah was faced with paramount challenges after 9/11, which should be tackled with wisdom and acumen. The Imam-e-Kaaba said he was disappointed to note that the Lal Masjid brigade had involved women and children who, he said "should not be used (in such activity)."

He said that seizing mosques was an act of enemies of Islam and Pakistan. "Being a well-wisher of Pakistan, I request these people to act while remaining within the clearly defined commandments of the religion. Any transgression will only accomplish the objectives of the enemy," he said.

He said Islam does not allow anybody to make mosques sanctuary this way. This is no wise method, he said, adding that mosques are Houses of Allah Almighty, not meant to show power by any person or group. "Anybody who likes to enforce Islamic Shariah can't force it on his own. It can't be enforced at the individual level. Ulema and those having knowledge of Islam should be approached for this purpose."

Al-Sudais expressed the hope that the issue would remain confined to the local level and would be resolved amicably. However, he said there are a lot of people in Pakistan who understand the religion and its spirit well, and a wrong course adopted by some would not make any difference.

"I counsel these people to compassionately resolve the issue according to the distinguished principles of Islam in consultation with the government, Ulema and officials," the Imam-e-Kaaba stressed. He said Islam does not allow violence, terrorism and use of force. The religion teaches mutual compassion and emphasises on love and affection.

Al-Sudais said that in an Islamic government, everybody cannot act on his own and has to follow the system and institutions of the state. Anarchy and chaos, he said, are worse than murder, and Muslims must have to act collectively. They are not allowed to adopt an independent path.

The Imam-e-Kaaba said Muslims are protectors of each other while limiting themselves to the confines of the law, and the rules prescribed by the state institutions. Islam prohibits taking any actions that divide Muslims.

Al-Sudais said nobody is infallible, and anybody can commit wrongs but there are clear ways provided in Islam to rectify them. Islam specifies resolution of problems through consultations, he said.

The Imam-e-Kaaba said Islam has cut off the roots of violence. The religion has laid immense emphasis on compassion, consideration and care for others. Wherever violence will creep in, there will be more trouble and problems, he said.

Quoting the Holy Prophet (PBUH), Al-Sudais said that the "air of heaven would not touch anybody who would kill a non-Muslim covered by an agreement." Islam teaches moderation and abhors extremism and violence, he said.

Answering a question, the Imam-e-Kaaba said sectarianism has no room in Islam. The religion, he said, lays down principles of brotherhood and harmony. Mosques, he said, should not be used to spread mayhem and disarray.

To a question, Al-Sudais said there are many misconceptions and misgivings prevailing about Jihad, which was the pinnacle of the religion. The first condition, he said, is that the Imam (leader) should lead and organize it according to the true Sharia commandments. "No individual can or has the right to declare and wage Jihad."

The second condition, he said, is that there must be sufficient preparation for launching Jihad. "Jihad is of different kinds relating to one's own soul, attainment of knowledge, of pen and wealth. It is also a Jihad to be guardian of a widow."

The Imam-e-Kaaba said Jihad should be taken in its comprehensive sense when sovereign states exist. "But starting Jihad without appropriate preparations is not Islam. When the Holy Prophet (PBUH) did not have power in Makkah, he acted differently and when he had power in Madina, he proceeded in a different fashion."

Today, Al-Sudais said, Muslims don't possess the requisite power to launch Jihad (war) against others. There are specific conditions that must be fulfilled before starting this kind of Jihad, he said. "There is no doubt that everyone amongst us cherishes martyrdom."

Replying to a question about inter-faith dialogue, the Imam-e-Kaaba said Islam teaches friendship and harmony with all to promote relations with others. Prophets engaged in dialogues with other nations and the Holy Prophet (PBUH) also talked to all schools of thought. Islam, he said, ordains the use of convincing and persuasive methods to persuade others and if they are not swayed, it lets them to continue their path.

Islam, the Imam-e-Kaaba said, is not the religion of rituals alone and it guides human beings in all spheres. That's why, he said, Islam is spreading fast. It favours a positive dialogue with others and calls for cooperation with humanity. The religion has always benefited from such interactions as it has been winning hearts and minds, he added. Al-Sudais said he considers Pakistan as his second home. He said he had found immense sentiments of love and affection during his present visit.


http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=8279

CheesyMuslim
06-03-2007, 03:38 AM
Sorry bout that,

1. SMOKESCREEN.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

ViolaLee
06-03-2007, 03:39 AM
Thank Allah.

ViolaLee
06-03-2007, 03:42 AM
Sorry bout that,

1. SMOKESCREEN.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas


You're going to have to come to terms with the fact that Islam itself is not evil. I know it's hard, but just like the KKK, you bigots have to realize people are all equal and it's wrong to hate a whole group for what a few do. If you don't you're just a dumb white guy who makes us all look bad. There are those just like you, who believe Americans are all assholes, but I hope most people know it's wrong to hate a whole group for what a few, like you, do.

bobbylien
06-03-2007, 04:14 AM
If you don't you're just a dumb white guy who makes us all look bad.
How do you know hes white? :P

CheesyMuslim
06-03-2007, 01:03 PM
Sorry bout that,




Sorry bout that,

1. SMOKESCREEN.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas


You're going to have to come to terms with the fact that Islam itself is not evil. I know it's hard, but just like the KKK, you bigots have to realize people are all equal and it's wrong to hate a whole group for what a few do. If you don't you're just a dumb white guy who makes us all look bad. There are those just like you, who believe Americans are all assholes, but I hope most people know it's wrong to hate a whole group for what a few, like you, do.



1. You haven't been keeping up lately.
2. I asked to see some tracts from Mosques here in America.
3. A couple of threads have been created that prove Islam is propagating its evil with these tracts from Saudi Arabia, centered in Mecca.
4. Other American Sources confirmed it.
5. Where you been ViolaLee?
6. You sound like a little girl lost in the woods.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

preservanation
06-03-2007, 01:07 PM
Sorry bout that,




Sorry bout that,

1. SMOKESCREEN.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas


You're going to have to come to terms with the fact that Islam itself is not evil. I know it's hard, but just like the KKK, you bigots have to realize people are all equal and it's wrong to hate a whole group for what a few do. If you don't you're just a dumb white guy who makes us all look bad. There are those just like you, who believe Americans are all assholes, but I hope most people know it's wrong to hate a whole group for what a few, like you, do.



1. You haven't been keeping up lately.
2. I asked to see some tracts from Mosques here in America.
3. A couple of threads have been created that prove Islam is propagating its evil with these tracts from Saudi Arabia, centered in Mecca.
4. Other American Sources confirmed it.
5. Where you been ViolaLee?
6. You sound like a little girl lost in the woods.

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

Agreed on all accounts.
The evidence is there. The fact that some people choose to ignore it is perplexing and very, very dangerous.

jafar00
06-03-2007, 07:55 PM
قُلْ Ù*َا Ø£ÙŽÙ*ُّهَا الْكَافِرُو٠*ÙŽ
لَا أَعْبُدُ مَا تَعْبُدُوÙ*ÙŽ
وَلَا Ø£ÙŽÙ*تُمْ عَابِدُوÙ*ÙŽ مَا أَعْبُدُ
وَلَا Ø£ÙŽÙ*َا عَابِدٌ مَّا عَبَدتُّمْ
وَلَا Ø£ÙŽÙ*تُمْ عَابِدُوÙ*ÙŽ مَا أَعْبُدُ
لَكُمْ دِÙ*Ù*ُكُمْ وَلِÙ*ÙŽ دِÙ*Ù*ِ

preservanation
06-03-2007, 07:58 PM
قُلْ Ù*َا Ø£ÙŽÙ*ُّهَا الْكَافِرُو٠*ÙŽ
لَا أَعْبُدُ مَا تَعْبُدُوÙ*ÙŽ
وَلَا Ø£ÙŽÙ*تُمْ عَابِدُوÙ*ÙŽ مَا أَعْبُدُ
وَلَا Ø£ÙŽÙ*َا عَابِدٌ مَّا عَبَدتُّمْ
وَلَا Ø£ÙŽÙ*تُمْ عَابِدُوÙ*ÙŽ مَا أَعْبُدُ
لَكُمْ دِÙ*Ù*ُكُمْ وَلِÙ*ÙŽ دِÙ*Ù*ِ
What did you say about my mother?:D

CheesyMuslim
06-03-2007, 08:38 PM
Sorry bout that,




قُلْ Ù*َا Ø£ÙŽÙ*ُّهَا الْكَافِرُو٠*ÙŽ
لَا أَعْبُدُ مَا تَعْبُدُوÙ*ÙŽ
وَلَا Ø£ÙŽÙ*تُمْ عَابِدُوÙ*ÙŽ مَا أَعْبُدُ
وَلَا Ø£ÙŽÙ*َا عَابِدٌ مَّا عَبَدتُّمْ
وَلَا Ø£ÙŽÙ*تُمْ عَابِدُوÙ*ÙŽ مَا أَعْبُدُ
لَكُمْ دِÙ*Ù*ُكُمْ وَلِÙ*ÙŽ دِÙ*Ù*ِ
What did you say about my mother?:D


1. Hehehehehe,.......
2. Looks like we blew his brain up.
3. Has resorted to useless hexes, from Islam.
4. I burn your hex and curse it in hell right behind all Islam and everything it stands for.
5. If it isn't a hex/curse, never mind.
6. I have heard of Islam doing such, otherwise I wouldn't be jumping to a conclusion.
7. This being an American site, all Islamic text should be deleted.
8. Post haste!

Regards,
SirjamesofTexas

jafar00
06-03-2007, 08:51 PM
I knew that would cause the Islamophobes a little discomfort. :D

Here is the translation...

In the name of God, the most Gracious, most Merciful
Say: O unbelievers!
I do not serve that which you serve,
Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve:
Nor am I going to serve that which you serve,
Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve:
You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.
(Qur'aan, Surah 109 - Al Kaafiruun)

It's about tolerance of the beliefs of others and one of several places in the Qur'aan that stresses that Islam cannot be forced upon anyone who has rejected it.

And to think you thought it was some kind of hex Chess. :O

preservanation
06-03-2007, 08:55 PM
I knew that would cause the Islamophobes a little discomfort. :D

Here is the translation...

In the name of God, the most Gracious, most Merciful
Say: O unbelievers!
I do not serve that which you serve,
Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve:
Nor am I going to serve that which you serve,
Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve:
You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.
(Qur'aan, Surah 109 - Al Kaafiruun)
What are you guys, tennis players?
It's about tolerance of the beliefs of others and one of several places in the Qur'aan that stresses that Islam cannot be forced upon anyone who has rejected it.


What about the punitive tax and goat-status bestowed upon unbelievers? Is that a fallacy as well?

CheesyMuslim
06-03-2007, 09:09 PM
Sorry bout that,


I knew that would cause the Islamophobes a little discomfort. :D

Here is the translation...

In the name of God, the most Gracious, most Merciful
Say: O unbelievers!
I do not serve that which you serve,
Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve:
Nor am I going to serve that which you serve,
Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve:
You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.
(Qur'aan, Surah 109 - Al Kaafiruun)

It's about tolerance of the beliefs of others and one of several places in the Qur'aan that stresses that Islam cannot be forced upon anyone who has rejected it.

And to think you thought it was some kind of hex Chess. :O


1. That's what I been saying all along, we don't serve the same Gawd, as Islam seems to say all the time.
2. You serve a chunk of rock behind a sheet of bullet proof glass in Mecca, on that black square building, that they all swirl around.
3. I serve the One and Only Gawd, Jesus Christ.
4. Far different, I agree.
5. Please come again!

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

jafar00
06-03-2007, 09:15 PM
What about the punitive tax and goat-status bestowed upon unbelievers? Is that a fallacy as well?


Do elaborate.


1. That's what I been saying all along, we don't serve the same Gawd, as Islam seems to say all the time.
2. You serve a chunk of rock behind a sheet of bullet proof glass in Mecca, on that black square building, that they all swirl around.
3. I serve the One and Only Gawd, Jesus Christ.
4. Far different, I agree.
5. Please come again!

Regards,
SirJamesofTexas


1) We do actually, it's just that some of you stubbornly worship his Prophet instead for some reason
2) God is not a lump of rock.
3) Jesus(upon him peace) is a Holy Prophet. A MAN who totally submitted to God's will. He never claimed to be God.

preservanation
06-04-2007, 12:09 AM
Post: #14RE: Imam of holiest place in Islam denounces extremist violence


preservanation Wrote:
What about the punitive tax and goat-status bestowed upon unbelievers? Is that a fallacy as well?

Jafar00:
Do elaborate.

Do Christian Arab tribes have to pay the jizyah tax, instead of being attacked and killed? ...see Sura 9:29

According to Ibn Abi Zayd al-Qayrawani a 10th century Maliki jurist:
Jihad is a precept of Divine institution. Its performance by certain individuals may dispense others from it. We Malikis maintain that it is preferable not to begin hostilities with the enemy before having invited the latter to embrace the religion of Allah except where the enemy attacks first. They have the alternative of either converting to Islam or paying the poll tax (jizya), short of which war will be declared against them.

According to al-Mawardi an 11th Century Shafi'i jurist
The mushrikun [infidels] of Dar al-Harb (the arena of battle) are of two types: First, those whom the call of Islam has reached, but they have refused it and have taken up arms. The amir of the army has the option of fighting them…in accordance with what he judges to be in the best interest of the Muslims and most harmful to the mushrikun… Second, those whom the invitation to Islam has not reached, although such persons are few nowadays since Allah has made manifest the call of his Messenger…it is forbidden to…begin an attack before explaining the invitation to Islam to them, informing them of the miracles of the Prophet and making plain the proofs so as to encourage acceptance on their part; if they still refuse to accept after this, war is waged against them and they are treated as those whom the call has reached…

and what about this?
"Fight and slay the Unbelievers wherever ye find them. Seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem of war."
Qur'an, Sura 9:5
:question: