Funny bigot ranting about Dick Cheney and his grandson

[Alonzo]

It was just a few words in the fine print under a news release photograph of Vice President Dick Cheney, his wife Lynne and their newborn grandson, Samuel David Cheney, but it has Christian organizations praying for the sins of the administration.

The caption included the words: "...His parents are the Cheneys' daughter Mary, and her partner, Heather Poe. White House photo by David Bohrer."

"I say shame on the White House, shame on the president and shame on the vice president for allowing such a caption to be 'officially' added onto the White House website and such a beautiful photo of two happy grandparents and their new grandchild," said Stephen Bennett, founder of Stephen Bennett Ministries, which advocates for those who choose to leave the homosexual lifestyle.

He also works with The Parents Group, a subscription service that offers counsel to parents and other family of those who have chosen the homosexual lifestyle.

"I guess we can tragically and officially say both the White House and the Bush Administration have officially recognized the sinful sexual unions of homosexuals, as well as recognized and embraced the tragedy of the social experiment of homosexual parenting," he said.

The actual caption of the photo read: "Vice President Dick Cheney and his wife, Lynne Cheney, welcomed their sixth grandchild, Samuel David Cheney, Wednesday, May 23, 2007. He weighed 8 lbs., 6 oz and was born at 9:46 a.m. at Sibley Hospital in Washington, D.C. His parents are the Cheneys' daughter Mary, and her partner, Heather Poe. White House photo by David Bohrer."

But Bennett wondered, "Since when have two homosexual women been able to naturally procreate?"

"Fact is Mary Cheney, the vice president's daughter – in one way or another – received a male's sperm. She is the biological mother, parent number one, and some man, somewhere out there, is Samuel David's real biological father, parent number two," he said.

"Unlike the official White House photo caption, a man and a woman, a Daddy and a Mommy, are Samuel David Cheney's REAL biological parents," he said. "Then who is Heather Poe?"

Simply "Mary Cheney's live-in lesbian lover," he said.

"Everyone knows there can only be one REAL biological Mommy. We are all grown adults. Playing 'house' is a game for children, not for The White House or the vice president and his wife," he said.

Bennett, who lived in the homosexual lifestyle for 11 years – with more than 100 partners – until he left in 1992, said what is even worse is the double standard for the Bush administration.

"President George W. Bush held several presses conferences calling for a Federal Marriage Amendment to protect the God-ordained institution of marriage between one man and one woman, while homosexuals pushed for the union of two men or two women to be equally recognized as real 'marriage,'" Bennett said.

"However, … Cheney clearly rebels against his superior, makes a public mockery of the president and the current administration he is supposed to represent, and clearly holds to a different set of moral standards and beliefs," Bennett said. "When President Bush stood on the victory stage several years ago after being elected into office by values voters, Mary Cheney was on stage as well with her lesbian lover, Heather Poe. It was a slap in the face to the values voters who had just elected the duo into office. That wound has never healed."

Bennett, now married for 14 years with two children, advocates for the traditional family and the protection of children from the homosexual lifestyle.

In a separate e-mail to his ministry supporters, he said the issue had to be addressed.

"Please know, as commanded by scripture, we pray for our president and leaders over us and are called to submit ourselves to authority. However, if this authority is promoting SIN – are we to obey God – or man?" he asked. "We love, honor and respect our president and vice president. However, now is the time to join in fervent prayer … as pressure from homosexual groups NO DOUBT [is] influencing even the smallest of things – as a photo op. and caption placed on the photo."

"Every child deserves a Daddy and Mommy. We understand, sometimes through death or divorce, that unit is broken – and parents do the best they could to raise and nurture their child or children. That's where we as the Body of Christ step in to help and be there for the family and child. We celebrate these individuals and families. Sometimes in a second heterosexual marriage, children are adopted. We praise these men and women who do all they could to raise these children. THESE ARE REAL PARENTS. This is NOT playing 'house,'" he said.


http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=55933

This may be one of those things that only I find funny, but the guy ranting about Cheney's lover being labelled "parent" seems bizarre and ridiculous.

[ViolaLee]

It would be funnier if those extremists and freakish Christian righties didn't have so much political power.

But since they do, it's more scary than funny.

To me.

[lily]

Don't like the man, but I'm one of those that think the kids of political figures are off limits, unless they break some kind of law. Doesn't matter if they are grown kids or not.

Not to change the subject so fast, but......

"However, … Cheney clearly rebels against his superior, makes a public mockery of the president and the current administration he is supposed to represent, and clearly holds to a different set of moral standards and beliefs," Bennett said.

I think he would have more of a case for this when Cheney shot his friend in the face and didn't tell Bush or anyone until the next day.

[Labrocca]

Yeah the Cheneys grandchild should be off-limits. I understand his anger though voting in people he was expecting to be more on the Christian right but that's not Cheney nor is it Bush nor is the Republicans overall (imho). The Christian right need to form their own party imho and break away from voting Republican.

[ViolaLee]

....... The Christian right need to form their own party imho and break away from voting Republican.
From your fingertips to God's ear!

[Labrocca]

From your fingertips to God's ear!

And does that suppose to mean? Don't assume too much about me or my religious ideas. You think because I have Republican next to my avatar that I must be some Christian Right Winger..you couldn't be further from the truth.

[lily]

Labrocca.......ease up......it's a joke.........just a saying. It means She agrees with you.

Sheeezzzzz

[manu1959]

It would be funnier if those extremists and freakish Christian righties didn't have so much political power.

But since they do, it's more scary than funny.

To me.


if they had the power that your post implies you would not be able to type what you just did......

you are given power you can not take it.....

[Labrocca]

Labrocca.......ease up......it's a joke.........just a saying.


I have yet to find any humor in her posts. I have a funny feeling she isn't laughing with me but AT me.

[manu1959]

The Christian right need to form their own party imho and break away from voting Republican.


i so wish this would happen......i get so tired of being lumped in with this crowd

[Truth_and_Power]

Nothing pisses off christians more than happy "sinners".

[Buck Laser]

Nothing pisses off christians more than happy "sinners".

I think you have it a bit wrong. It should read "Nothing pisses off some christians more than happy "sinners." I am very happy that Ms. Cheney and her partner have a baby. I think that, despite Dick Cheney's politics, the little boy is likely to grow up happy and surrounded by love.

[exigent]

I think that, despite Dick Cheney's politics, the little boy is likely to grow up happy and surrounded by love.


...and privilege.

[Marley]

Nothing pisses off christians more than happy "sinners".

Please realize that ALL Christians consider themselves "sinners."

Lily, FWIW you are a true independent, a rare commodity.

I agree, obviously these innocent children are being exploited for politics.

It's very sophisticated and subtle, but it's still exploitation of innocent bystanders

[Truth_and_Power]

The Christian right need to form their own party imho and break away from voting Republican.


i so wish this would happen......i get so tired of being lumped in with this crowd


If we had more than two parties, it would happen.

[Labrocca]

Reading this a week later ...I almost feel like changing my mind. Heather Poe is certainly not a parent. Legally I bet she is NOT a parent and so I don't see how listing her in an official archive is a smart idea. As a matter of fact..this could be used in a court. The pro-gay activists would argue that even the White House recognizes officially the rights of a gay partner as a parent. This sets a precedent and it's dangerous once again.

While the child should be off limits I don't believe Heather Poe is. This attack by the religious right is on her not the grandchild.

Oddly...you know that lesbian couple I mentioned that are friends (read it somewhere)...well anyways...they have 3 kids been married a couple years now together maybe..6-7 years? I knew the biological mom BEFORE she became a lesbian..she was married to a man twice and this woman woo'd her until she broke. She convinced her men are scum and she doesn't need them....

Well guess what. This holier than thought BITCH now is divorcing our friend. Here is the really bad part..she just had the 3rd child whom is VERY sick..was born about 1lb and at 5 months I think. Her father is about to die too. And her home life is miserable...her partner has been going out and partying and finding new "friends" while she is at home trying to take care of the kids, make food, work...all that...

Now they are not divorcing because our friend wants to (although she should) but because this woman had the NERVE to tell her she wants to be out of the relationship. HOW DARE SHE!!! My wife wants to fly out there and beat the crap out of her and I don't blame her. It's all a real mess for our friend and she is seriously depressed and crying...near suicidal and we are very worried.

Anyways...long rant and maybe off the marker a bit but heck..I had to post this somewhere.

The next question though which is related...if they divorce will the non-biological mom have visitation rights? The dad is in a gay relationship as well but the 2-fathers don't do jack either. Our friend basically had 3 kids with 3 other adults and none of them give a rats ass except her. One great reason why this gay relationship stuff involving kids doesn't fly for me. Parents are people that LOVE their kids...biggest reason to love kids...because they are your flesh and blood. You don't have that base in a gay relationship. I know there are exceptions but I consider it the rule.

Back to the legality though...what rights does she have for visitation? And if she does have parental rights then shouldn't she be forced to pay child support?

This all goes back to Heather Poe because the white house is recognizing her as a parent. Does anyone know if Poe did legally adopt the child?

Our friends partner has NOT legally adopted the kids yet although it's been intended.

Woo...long ass rant.

[Alonzo]

Your friends situation is sad, but I fail to see how it applies with this couple as you seem to be using it to argue that lesbian parents are bad for kids. But what makes a parent labrocca? Is it what the person does or what they are? If the women behaves in every way like a parent then she is one.

[Labrocca]

See Zo...you make my point once again. So because this woman "acted" like a parent does she now have parental rights by law?

And I mention my experience because it's my own first-hand knowledge. A lot of people talk about issues they have no experience with. I think it's important that you understand where I am coming from and why. Often those who are anti-gay are accused of being religious right and I think that's unfair.

And I do think gay parenting isn't the best idea and so far from my personal experience...it's a terrible idea.

[Alonzo]

Labrocca, if you were to pick a parent at random from my family more likely than not you would pick one that isn't very good, most just neglectful or indifferent, but a little emotional abuse and a few violent ones (though the ones who we know were violent are all dead or divorced out of the family). But I don't use that to oppose heterosexual parenting. So while it's sad, and I can clearly see where you're coming from, it doesn't seem reasonable to base your opinion on your experience with one or two same sex couples when there are at least tens of thousands of them out there.

I'm not saying what you're doing isn't normal, but it doesn't really make much sense to base an opinion about an entire group on just one experience.

And again, I always go back to the available data on same sex parenting. It's not the most heavily researched aspect of homosexuality, but the data that is there simply doesn't support the idea that there is any significant difference between homosexual and heterosexual parents.

So because this woman "acted" like a parent does she now have parental rights by law?


She should, though at this points it's a case by case and state by state basis. In MA mary cheneys partner probably would (assuming they're not married, if so then she definately would), but probably not in a place like Florida or Texas.

[Labrocca]

But Zo...you have to admit there is nothing better in life than personal experience. Someone telling you what's right or wrong is facism at it's worst. Polls, surveys, and studies are almost always tainted. I been part of more than my share of studies and they are always looking to get a result for their client that fits their ideals. Which is what many accuse the Bush administration of pulling with the War Intelligence.

So...while I do understand the difference between what I don't know and what I do know. I prefer to trust what I do know for sure from my own experiences. I can't speak for everyone but I can certainly base my own opinion on my own experiences and not others.

That makes me a free thinker...how about you? Or do you just read a paper that says X is good and then you're convinced?

The first books were religious. If everyone believed what they read we would all be religious fanatics...keep that in mind too.

[Alonzo]

I don't know everyone labrocca. I have experiences with the people I know. It's difficult to form an opinion on a population of millions based on the small amount of people any one of us encounter in our day to day lives.

So you're asking me whether an experience with one or a few people (as is the case for most people when it comes to a minority such as same sex parents) is more valuable than a study taking into acounts hundreds of those people? Everyone has their own experiences and they're all different. They reflect on certain people, but they can't speak about the population as a whole.

You have a bad experience and decide your opinion based on one couple. How many dysfunction heterosexual couples do you know? What are the odds of picking any one of those at random?

The first books were religious. If everyone believed what they read we would all be religious fanatics...keep that in mind too.

What was the foundation of those books?

[lily]

But Zo...you have to admit there is nothing better in life than personal experience. Someone telling you what's right or wrong is facism at it's worst.

.......and then we have the experience one of our posters posted about her children and her life.

What you have described in you post, could happen to any couple, being gay has nothing to do with anything.

Back to the legality though...what rights does she have for visitation?

In the case of your friend, I wouldn't think she has any more or any less rights that a second or third husband/wife would in a hetrosexual relationship. In the case of Poe, I would say yes.

And if she does have parental rights then shouldn't she be forced to pay child support?

Yes. Women pay child support all the time.

[Labrocca]

You have a bad experience and decide your opinion based on one couple.

I base my opinion on a few things but personal experience is certainly ranked high. And it's not just one gay couple I know that's dysfunctional. And yes...I know lot of hetero couples that are dysfunctional as well.

Back to the topic though and the white house recognizing Poe as a parent...Again..the gay community would LOVE family to be redefined. The redefining includes terms like parents and marriage. You say now that a gay parent has rights...

I wouldn't think she has any more or any less rights that a second or third husband/wife would in a hetrosexual relationship.

Well that's the problem...second or third spouses normally have NO rights to children after a divorce unless that person legally adopted the child. I have asked but no one seems to know if POE has adopted the Cheney child. I am gonna assume she hasn't. So here we have a case where a non-biologically related person gets rights to visit or raise a child that isn't theirs. That's not cool imho and it's MORE rights than heteros have. Gays should be a special class with their own rules. For them to attempt to redefine existing laws and rules should be blocked. If gays want rights...I am all for it.

You are gonna hate this comparison but let's take handicaps (wheelchair ones to be specific). Certain laws were created to handle their special circumstances. Wheelchair access is not a right for them. All government building must have wheelchair access. Many business comply with certain laws enacted specially for handicaps. They didn't redefine access for everyone...just make it clear that for handicaps...they must be able to give them access as well in some form. You don't see them converting escalators or stairways..no you seem them creating new entry ways.

It just doesn't make sense to me that gays want marriage and parenthood exactly the same as hetero couples. It's simply NOT the same. Children are a great example. If I was gay...and my significant other fathered a child..and we raised that child for say...6 years...then I would expect to be a father under the law. However current laws do not suffice to support gay relationships. You also run a great risk by saying 'ANYONE' married to another person with a child automatically adopts the child. Gay rights need to be established with a civil union act that even heteros can take part in if they wish. Something that handles these type of situations specifically.

[lily]

Again..the gay community would LOVE family to be redefined. The redefining includes terms like parents and marriage. You say now that a gay parent has rights...

Sorry, Labrocca........after reading pages and pages of why marriage can't be redefined.......I'm not going to touch this one.

I wouldn't think she has any more or any less rights that a second or third husband/wife would in a hetrosexual relationship.

Well that's the problem...second or third spouses normally have NO rights to children after a divorce unless that person legally adopted the child. I have asked but no one seems to know if POE has adopted the Cheney child. I am gonna assume she hasn't. So here we have a case where a non-biologically related person gets rights to visit or raise a child that isn't theirs.

The part you quoted was in response to what your friend was going through......this is what I thought about the Poe case:

In the case of Poe, I would say yes.

The difference is your firend's "wife" wasn't there at the birth of the children you were talking about. Poe and Cheney were together, decided who was going to carry the child and for all intents and purposes were a married couple.......doing what any other couple would do when having a child that they can't concieve themselves. Any "husband" in a hetrosexual relationship would have rights to see the child, if he and his wife divorced.

[Alonzo]

Again..the gay community would LOVE family to be redefined. The redefining includes terms like parents and marriage. You say now that a gay parent has rights...

Growing up gay rights wasn't even an issue. Treat them with respect was about the most I ever heard, and the first time I ever really saw it adressed was on All in the Family where Edie's friend (or aunt) lifelong lesbian lover died.

At the same time I was raised with the concept that everyone who's either related, or who loves you and you live with, is family. Cousins and things like that were secondary family, far and away the most important ones are those who live with you or lived with you (such as a divorced parent). I'd never heard of two mommies or two daddies until years later. But, at the same time, my definition of family was never based on gender. It was based on those who raised you and those who loved you. That wasn't intentional, their was no effort to make it gender neutral as no one saw the reason to do so. It's just gender was inconsequential to what the essential element of a family was.

It just doesn't make sense to me that gays want marriage and parenthood exactly the same as hetero couples. It's simply NOT the same. Children are a great example. If I was gay...and my significant other fathered a child..and we raised that child for say...6 years...then I would expect to be a father under the law. However current laws do not suffice to support gay relationships.

They do in massachusetts, and probably Vermont, new hampshire, connecticut etc. In massachusetts laws do not give consideration to gender when it comes to family and marriage. Those laws that do and are still on the books have been consistently overturned in recent years as unconstitutional and what's left is essentially unenforceable (unless you want to waste your time going to court to almost certainly lose), as discrimination based on gender or sexual orientation is banned in thise state.

[Labrocca]

A) They are in Mass.
B) They did decide to become parents together along with a gay male couple. I don't know exact details but the father is the same guy for all 3 kids. I don't know if the "wife" was there for all 3 births but they were certainly a couple.

I would not be shocked to see this case picked up by news agency if they go to court over custody. This is something a pro-gay and anti-gay rights activists would latch onto. I was trying to explain all this to my wife.

[Alonzo]

I'm not sure why they shouldn't have visitation rights. It's not good for the kids to lose contact with a parent who isn't violent or otherwise harmful to even be around.

I have to wonder what kind of environment you grew up in Labrocca. These issues that make you against same sex couples and parenting are par for the course for the majority of heterosexuals in my family, and it's not something that's just with this generation either. It's unfortunate but it's not like they're particularly unusual.

[underdawg]

I don't think you can just make generalizations about natural parents being better than adoptive ones. I certainly know many natural parents who are horrible parents. It all comes down to the individual. I know lots of homosexuals that should never be parents, but I also know lots of homosexuals who are excellent parents. As with anything else, it all comes down to the individual person. I certainly don't know anything about Lynn Cheney or her partner. I would certainly never say that Lynn's partner was automaticly a bad parent just because she happened to be gay.

[Labrocca]

I am not sure I made a generalization or judgement on gay parents. I did bring up a valid question of legality. If you can find where I say a generalization about gay parents being bad or better than hetero then you must have better vision than me.

And it's not just one gay couple I know that's dysfunctional. And yes...I know lot of hetero couples that are dysfunctional as well.

As a matter of fact I make it clear that I see dysfunctional families both gay and hetero.

My retorts are based on the legal questions involved. I even advocate gay parenting by saying special laws need to be created to answer the questions of law. No where do I say there should be laws preventing gay parenting. It's my view that gay parenting needs special laws though to make sure the rights are proper. A biological parent IS different than a non-biological one. The lawmakers and courts need to figure this out. That's when the real debates and battles begin.