Religion of Peace 6: Random House Pulls Novel; Fears Muslim Violence

[apdst]

If I were the head honcho at Random House, I would want to publish the book even MORE. How much does political correctness suck?

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSN0736008820080807

Random House pulls novel on Islam, fears violence
Thu Aug 7, 2008 6:39pm EDT

NEW YORK (Reuters) - Publisher Random House has pulled a novel about the Prophet Mohammed's child bride, fearing it could "incite acts of violence."

"The Jewel of Medina," a debut novel by journalist Sherry Jones, 46, was due to be published on August 12 by Random House, a unit of Bertelsmann AG, and an eight-city publicity tour had been scheduled, Jones told Reuters on Thursday.

The novel traces the life of A'isha from her engagement to Mohammed, when she was six, until the prophet's death. Jones said that she was shocked to learn in May, that publication would be postponed indefinitely.

"I have deliberately and consciously written respectfully about Islam and Mohammed ... I envisioned that my book would be a bridge-builder," said Jones.

Random House deputy publisher Thomas Perry said in a statement the company received "cautionary advice not only that the publication of this book might be offensive to some in the Muslim community, but also that it could incite acts of violence by a small, radical segment."

"In this instance we decided, after much deliberation, to postpone publication for the safety of the author, employees of Random House, booksellers and anyone else who would be involved in distribution and sale of the novel," Perry said.

Jones, who has just completed a sequel to the novel examining her heroine's later life, is free to sell her book to other publishers, Perry said.

The decision has sparked controversy on Internet blogs and in academic circles. Some compared the controversy to previous cases where portrayals of Islam were met with violence.

[micfranklin]

Straws, straws, straws and even more straws.

[apdst]

What's-a-matter, Mic? Gotta problem with Muhhamed being a baby fucker?

Islam is a religion to be proud of, to be sure.

[micfranklin]

They haven't done anything wrong yet, at least according to your story.

[apdst]

I guess they won't do anything wrong, since Random House is pussing out.

I hope another house picks this book up.

[micfranklin]

Okay so they go find another company to put the book out, but why blame Muslims for something that hasn't happened?

[AnnEsthesia]

Yea and no one would say anything about a book where Jesus was whoring around with men and little boys. *rolls eyes*

[apdst]

Yea and no one would say anything about a book where Jesus was whoring around with men and little boys.

How many times have Christians went a killing spree because of something offensive being put out about Chritianity. Don't embarress yourself by bringing up something that happened a thousand years ago.

[AnnEsthesia]

apdst, no one went on a killing spree. Just because someone said they might does not make it true.

[micfranklin]

How many times have Christians went a killing spree because of something offensive being put out about Chritianity. Don't embarress yourself by bringing up something that happened a thousand years ago.

I don't know about them killing people because of cartoons but they still have killed people for stupid stuff. Ever heard of mass lynchings?

[apdst]

apdst, no one went on a killing spree.

There was NO violence due to the Mohammed cartoons? None??

Ever heard of mass lynchings?

Mass lynchings? No, never heard of a mass lyncing. Care to show me some info on that?

I've heard of mass killings be Muslims. 9/11 comes to mind.


11. All proper names of political figures should be spelled correctly. Nicknames like Hitlary or Chimpy are unacceptable.

[AnnEsthesia]

*snore* Again... I am sure that people have tried to publish books here Jesus is a character and does things that would offend Christians. But no one made a big deal out of it when the publishers refused to publish them.

[apdst]

I am sure that people have tried to publish books here Jesus is a character and does things that would offend Christians.

Being pissed is one thing. Killing and burning is something totally different.

But no one made a big deal out of it when the publishers refused to publish them.

Random House refused to publish a book they deemed offensive to Christians? Which book was it?

Random House refused to publish this book out of fear; fear of the Muslim violence in recent years over this sorta thing.

If the Muslims were as peaceful as you like to claim, Random House wouldn't have to fear anything. Would they?

[micfranklin]

Mass lynchings? No, never heard of a mass lyncing. Care to show me some info on that?

All of those blacks who got lynched by the Klan way back when come to mind.

I've heard of mass killings be Muslims. 9/11 comes to mind.

Yeah, and they haven't done a mass killing on that level since 9/11.

[AnnEsthesia]

apdst, I understand. You have a hatred for muslims. We have noted it. But I will leave you to your spewing. Have 'fun'.

[apdst]

All of those blacks who got lynched by the Klan way back when come to mind.

They weren't mass lynchings. However, the KKK isn't a religion. It's a pack-a-asshats. I think we can all agree that they should all be killed off, just like the Muslims.

Yeah, and they haven't done a mass killing on that level since 9/11.

That's right, because WE have been spankin' their fucking asses.

[apdst]

apdst, I understand. You have a hatred for muslims.

Islam is a religion. I'm well within the rules of political correctness to hate a religion. Just like I hate KKK members, Nazis, Commies. Yeah, you bet. Don't you?

[AnnEsthesia]

No, I don't hate the religion. I hate the extremists. I have good friends who are muslims and I certainly do not hate them.

[apdst]

No, I don't hate the religion. I hate the extremists.

Are you a prescriber to the, "there are good Nazis and bad Nazis", school of thought?

I have good friends who are muslims and I certainly do not hate them.

I love it when people drag their Muslim friends out of the closet at times like this.

[micfranklin]

They weren't mass lynchings. However, the KKK isn't a religion. It's a pack-a-asshats.

I never said the KKK was a religion but they're a bunch of white supremacists who happen to be Christian and enjoy hating and preying on other races i.e. racial terrorism.

I think we can all agree that they should all be killed off, just like the Muslims

From reading that its obvious you got a problem. So what size swastika do you wear? Would you like to gather some friends and go on an old-fashioned witch hunt?

That's right, because WE have been spankin' their fucking asses.

Okay.

[micfranklin]

Islam is a religion. I'm well within the rules of political correctness to hate a religion. Just like I hate KKK members, Nazis, Commies. Yeah, you bet. Don't you?

But you act so much like a KKK though...

[AnnEsthesia]

Are you a prescriber to the, "there are good Nazis and bad Nazis", school of thought?



I love it when people drag their Muslim friends out of the closet at times like this.

You cannot compare the Nazis with Islam. Apples and oranges.

[apdst]

But you act so much like a KKK though...

How so?

You cannot compare the Nazis with Islam.

Why not?

[micfranklin]

How so?

Let's backtrack shall we?

I think we can all agree that they should all be killed off, just like the Muslims

Killing off all the Muslims sounds a lot like genocide to me and it takes a really sick mind to advocate the death of 1.8 billion people.

If we're not trying to destroy Islam, then we should be. Islam is as big a scurge as the Nazis and the Commies.

Again, another genocidal post advocating mass killings.

Not all Muslims are terrorists, but all Muslims condone terrorism.

There are NO legions of Muslims forming to stop Islamic extremism. There are more Muslims that support it, or at the minimum say and do nothing, than there are that are actively fighting against it.

Pretty big blanket statements you made there that pretty much say all Muslims condone terrorism and wish to destroy us.

That's Aftrica for ya. You can do what you want to try and make it better, but the reality is, there's no such thing as a successful black government.

Apartheid ended in South Africa, the blacks took control of the government and now South Africa is an even bigger shit-hole than it was before.

Here you don't think black people can run a successful government anywhere. Sounds like something a Klan member would say to me.

I'm anti-Mulsim the same way I'm anti-Communist, anti-Nazi and anti-KKK. I wear your comments as a badge of honor.

Trying to compare a select few Muslims to Commies, Nazis and the Klan. Real educated there.

So, it's all about the numbers? The Muslims aren't as bad because they haven't racked the same amount of kills? The point I've been making is that--regardless of numbers--Islam is just as bad as as the Nazis and the Commies. Numbers aside, the Muslims have been in the genocide business of alot longer than anyone else.

Another blanket statement with flawed or no historical figures to back it up.

So you see dude, you do have a serious racial problem here and you'd be pretty foolish to try and deny it.

[apdst]

Killing off all the Muslims sounds a lot like genocide

Genocide is the killing off of a race, or nationality. If we kill all the Muslims, it wouldn't be genocide. You should really stop confusing race with religion.

Here you don't think black people can run a successful government anywhere.

Kwame Kilpatrick, Ray Nagin, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton...shall I continue?

BTW, thanks for providing the actual links. That was very intellectually dishonest of you.

You had better watch out, Webwarrior will get on your ass for violating rule 14.

[AnnEsthesia]

Genocide is the killing off of a race, or nationality. If we kill all the Muslims, it wouldn't be genocide. You should really stop confusing race with religion.


No, it would just be a holocaust, something we are supposed to be against.

And don't go spouting rules apdst... you are saying things that should get your ass sanctioned. It is NOT ok to spout hate speech.

[micfranklin]

Genocide is the killing off of a race, or nationality. If we kill all the Muslims, it wouldn't be genocide. You should really stop confusing race with religion.

Wrong.

genocide (n): the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group.

Genocide is the deliberate and systematic destruction, in whole or in part, of an ethnic, racial, religious, or national group.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genocide

Religion counts for culture just so you know so yeah it would be genocide.

Kwame Kilpatrick, Ray Nagin, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton...shall I continue?

Oh wow, a whole four people, two of which don't lead the government at all and the other two don't count for every single black leader ever in existence.

BTW, thanks for providing the actual links. That was very intellectually dishonest of you.

You had better watch out, Webwarrior will get on your ass for violating rule 14.

I wasn't the one who made all the racist statements....you sure did make a name for yourself.

[Elrathin]

I think we can all agree that they should all be killed off, just like the Muslims..

So you think all Muslims should be killed off?

[IndieVisible]

Time for a truly UNbiased and Balanced Opinion by none other then INDIEvisible.

No party loyalty here as you should all know by now. And that certainly goes for the wanna-be LP too. SO I get to piss every one off at one time or another. BUT I promise you a truly unbiased opinion, always!

apdst- political correctness suck?

YES!!!

I am so sick of partisan bullshit! Why can't we just call it like it is?

TRUTH: Islam is the most barbaric, backwards, closed minded religion of all. It's reign of terror is undeniable yet some excuse or justify it by saying shit like, "but not all Muslims are like that. You can't judge a whole religion by some fanatics". YET THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT THESE HYPOCRITES DO ABOUT CHRISTIANITY!

A woman was JAILED for naming a teddy bear Mohammed! When those cartoons were published of Mohammed thousands took to the streets in rage ripping their shirts off and screaming death threats! Right, they do not represent the majority of Muslims :lmao:

People have written books and made movies portraying Jesus in a vast number of ways many considered offensive, but how many Americans ran out of their house and ripped their shirts of scream death threats?

Yes apdst, political correctness sucks big time, and so does partisan loyalty BULLSHIT!

I wish we could all be just freaking honest and forget about what party we like most! And simply call it for what it really is!

[micfranklin]

TRUTH: Islam is the most barbaric, backwards, closed minded religion of all. It's reign of terror is undeniable yet some excuse or justify it by saying shit like, "but not all Muslims are like that. You can't judge a whole religion by some fanatics". YET THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT THESE HYPOCRITES DO ABOUT CHRISTIANITY!

Oh yeah that was so not biased or bigoted.....

[lily]

TRUTH: Islam is the most barbaric, backwards, closed minded religion of all. It's reign of terror is undeniable yet some excuse or justify it by saying shit like, "but not all Muslims are like that. You can't judge a whole religion by some fanatics". YET THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT THESE HYPOCRITES DO ABOUT CHRISTIANITY!

I think barbaric closed minded is in the mind of whoever is looking in.....I don't see jafar chanting death to all Americans. I do see some odd religions that call themselves Christians though.....now those Pentecostal snake handlers to me are a little weird.....I think they need to go and those oddball Cloistered nuns, who knows what they are doing behind those closed walls, with their vows of silence? Morman........well even if they aren't those weird kind, they aren't the right type of Christians for the Christian coalition......those really need to be looked at a little closer too. The Little Flower.......now come on, we know no one goes out and helps the poor for no reason at all......they definately need to go!

..........and don't even get me started on the Franciscans or the Domnican nuns.........that would be a thread all to itself!

[AlanC]

Yea and no one would say anything about a book where Jesus was whoring around with men and little boys. *rolls eyes*


Well no, other than the fact that one is a historical reality and the one about Jesus is not. :lmao:

[apdst]

genocide (n): the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group.

Awww, look, the word, "religion", doesn't even exist in that definition.

And don't go spouting rules apdst... you are saying things that should get your ass sanctioned. It is NOT ok to spout hate speech.

How do you define hate speech? Any criticism that YOU don't like, or isn't pollitically correct? Well, all I can say to that is, tough shit.

Oh wow, a whole four people, two of which don't lead the government at all and the other two don't count for every single black leader ever in existence.

Provide us with the names of all the black heads of state that would prove me wrong. Nelson Mandela is a Commie, too, so you can't use him, either. The guy that rode in on Nelson's shirt tail is world renound for his corruption, so I guess he's out.

I don't see jafar chanting death to all Americans.

No, but he used to have a terrorist logo on his avatar and he consitantly sticks up for the folks that DO chant death to all Americans.

[Elrathin]

How do you define hate speech?

Criticizing is one thing, that is not hate speech. Saying that all Muslims should be killed IS hate speech.

[AnnEsthesia]

Thank you, E. I was wondering about that.

[Shoey]

But you act so much like a KKK though...

Below is actual footage of radical extreme Muslims acting like the KKK. Radical extreme Islam intends to conquer the world through violence.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDPzPgkr4vk&feature=related

"And you to will meet your destruction because Allah's religion will prevail on this earth"

[AnnEsthesia]

Radical extreme anything plans to spread and control the world and make it like them.

[IndieVisible]

Below is actual footage of radical extreme Muslims acting like the KKK. Radical extreme Islam intends to conquer the world through violence.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDPzPgkr4vk&feature=related

And I might add they represent the majority of Muslims. It's true there are some peaceful Muslims. Just don't hold your breath looking for too many.

[micfranklin]

Awww, look, the word, "religion", doesn't even exist in that definition.

Let me post the second definition again....

Genocide is the deliberate and systematic destruction, in whole or in part, of an ethnic, racial, religious, or national group.

Don't try to undermine definitions because you don't agree with them.

How do you define hate speech? Any criticism that YOU don't like, or isn't pollitically correct? Well, all I can say to that is, tough shit.

Advocating genocide = hate speech.

Provide us with the names of all the black heads of state that would prove me wrong. Nelson Mandela is a Commie, too, so you can't use him, either. The guy that rode in on Nelson's shirt tail is world renound for his corruption, so I guess he's out.

How about David Paterson for one example. On yeah Mandela counts as a sucessful leader for someone who was anti-apartheid in South Africa.

[micfranklin]

And I might add they represent the majority of Muslims. It's true there are some peaceful Muslims. Just don't hold your breath looking for too many.

Find some proof before generalizing plz.

[preservanation]

They instilled the fear of free speech through threats of violence in the hearts of the world.
In this the theocratic fascists have already won.

[IndieVisible]

Find some proof before generalizing plz.

I see all the proof I need on the news. Thousands of Muslims gathering in the streets chanting death to America over any little issue.

Could you show me proof otherwise that the majority are not so radical? Blog posts and forum posts don't count. I mean news footage showing thousands of Muslims gathering in a peaceful manor protesting their extremists or calling for world peace.

Didn't think so.

[Elrathin]

I see all the proof I need on the news.

So you believe everything you see on the news as being unbiased and completely truthful? :madlaugh:

[IndieVisible]

So you believe everything you see on the news as being unbiased and completely truthful? :madlaugh:

When it's actual video footage yes! Or you think may be that was staged by actors? may be we didn't really land on the moon too.

[Elrathin]

Could you show me proof otherwise that the majority are not so radical?

The number of Muslims in the world is about 1.2 billion. A Majority would have to be over 600,000. So a few thousand on the news and you think that is a majority? :madlaugh:This explains a lot.
I am not going to claim that the majority of Muslims like America, but I am sure in the hell going to dispute your claim (which you haven't provided any proof for anyway) that the majority are RADICAL MUSLIMS.

[Elrathin]

When it's actual video footage yes! Or you think may be that was staged by actors? may be we didn't really land on the moon too.

So because the Muslims you have seen on the news don't like America, they are Radical Muslims by default? Again, you have yet to show proof the majority are RADICAL. Not liking America does not qualify as radical by that alone.

[IndieVisible]

So because the Muslims you have seen on the news don't like America, they are Radical Muslims by default? Again, you have yet to show proof the majority are RADICAL. Not liking America does not qualify as radical by that alone.

So prove me wrong otherwise it's just your opinion against mine.

I have YET to see a video footage of a peaceful muslim gathering. Lets start there. Show me one where they called for world peace or spoke out against their radicals.

I can show you hundreds the other way around. So play with the numbers all you want. I think it's a fair reprepresentation of the facts.

Just show me one video of a gathering of 1000+ Muslims in a peaceful gathering, no burning American flags, no death chants, just one.

[preservanation]

Actually the radical Muslims are the ones condemning, violence, terrorism and 911...they're the ones going against the grain of current Islam.

[IndieVisible]

Actually the radical Muslims are the ones condemning, violence, terrorism and 911...they're the ones going against the grain of current Islam.

Call them whatever you want. The majority are anti-american, anti-israel and violent.

[AnnEsthesia]

MORE than 20,000 British Muslims gathered yesterday at a conference in London, the largest meeting of its kind to be held in Europe. Ken Livingstone, Michael Mansfield, QC, and the former Pakistan cricketers Saeed Anwar and Imran Khan were among the speakers promoting “global peace and unity”.


http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article745910.ece

[Elrathin]

So prove me wrong otherwise it's just your opinion against mine.

I have YET to see a video footage of a peaceful muslim gathering. Lets start there. Show me one where they called for world peace or spoke out against their radicals.

I can show you hundreds the other way around. So play with the numbers all you want. I think it's a fair reprepresentation of the facts.

Just show me one video of a gathering of 1000+ Muslims in a peaceful gathering, no burning American flags, no death chants, just one.

So because you don't see 1000s rallying for peace that means they automatically are Radical? What kind of logic is that?

Tell me are you out there in a rally for peace? If not, does that make you a radical for violence because of it?

You said the majority are RADICAL and you use for proof that the majority are not rallying for peace? Did it ever occur to you that there are Muslims that don't support the practice of radicals, but they don't like western ways? That doesn't make them radical just because they don't like America.

[AnnEsthesia]

No, the americans who rally for peace are called "libbos" and denigrated.

[IndieVisible]

So because you don't see 1000s rallying for peace that means they automatically are Radical? What kind of logic is that?

Tell me are you out there in a rally for peace? If not, does that make you a radical for violence because of it?

You said the majority are RADICAL and you use for proof that the majority are not rallying for peace? Did it ever occur to you that there are Muslims that don't support the practice of radicals, but they don't like western ways? That doesn't make them radical just because they don't like America.

So you could not find just one video then? Didn't think so. I stated my opinion, you stated yours.

[Elrathin]

So you could not find just one video then? Didn't think so. I stated my opinion, you stated yours.

Ok how about this:

http://www.arabnews.com/?page=4&section=0&article=111330&d=29&m=6&y=2008

or this

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article745910.ece

or this

http://media.www.dailytexanonline.com/media/storage/paper410/news/2007/09/10/TopStories/Muslim.March.For.Peace-2958255.shtml

or even this one which included Muslims, Jews, Christians, and Sikhs.

http://www.jewishaz.com/jewishnews/040430/muslim.shtml

Sorry to burst the bubble of many Muslim haters out there, but Muslims do rally for peace. Tell me Indie, why weren't ANY of those ever on the nightly news?

[IndieVisible]

Example of Hypocrisy

Some Christians who do not represent all Christians post anti-Muslim opinions and they represent a arrogant religion, spreading hate and intolerance!

Millions of Muslims chant death to Christians, Jews, and America and the response by those same people is pretty much,

oh leave them alone. They do not represent the majority, your just a bigot.

WTF is that all about?

You don't see thousands of Christians running in the streets ripping their shirts off swaear to God and calling for the extinction of a whole race. If you did you would all be outraged and I would be too!

How about you hold the Muslim religion to the same high standards you hold Christianity to?

[IndieVisible]

Ok how about this:

http://www.arabnews.com/?page=4&section=0&article=111330&d=29&m=6&y=2008

was regional conflict between Muslims, not related to America or Israel.

or this

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article745910.ece

Was in civilized UK nation, not in a Muslim nation, I want to see this in a MUSLIM NATION.

or this

http://media.www.dailytexanonline.com/media/storage/paper410/news/2007/09/10/TopStories/Muslim.March.For.Peace-2958255.shtml

held in USA capital, NOT a Muslim nation.

or even this one which included Muslims, Jews, Christians, and Sikhs.

http://www.jewishaz.com/jewishnews/040430/muslim.shtml

small rally in downtown Phoenix, NOT a Muslim nation.

Sorry to burst the bubble of many Muslim haters out there, but Muslims do rally for peace. Tell me Indie, why weren't ANY of those ever on the nightly news?

Bubble still intact now show me some thing in a MUSLIM nation

[Elrathin]

Millions of Muslims chant death to Christians, Jews, and America and the response by those same people is pretty much,

oh leave them alone.

LOL I love this logical falacy you are doing. Look, noone (especially me) is saying don't criticize radical Muslims. Knock yourself out, hell I probably agree with you more often than not.

All I'm pointing out is that saying the majority of Muslims are radical, just because that is what you see on the news is sorta silly. Especially since there are peace rallies from Muslims that get NO Main stream media attention at all on the nightly news broadcasts.

[IndieVisible]

LOL I love this logical falacy you are doing. Look, noone (especially me) is saying don't criticize radical Muslims. Knock yourself out, hell I probably agree with you more often than not.

All I'm pointing out is that saying the majority of Muslims are radical, just because that is what you see on the news is sorta silly. Especially since there are peace rallies from Muslims that get NO Main stream media attention at all on the nightly news broadcasts.

You have no more proved the majority of Muslims are peaceful then I have proved the majority are haters and violent. At least I can show you videos of such hate gatherings in every Muslim nation.

[Elrathin]

Bubble still intact now show me some thing in a MUSLIM nation

Ummm in some Muslim countries, they are not allowed to protest. Again, that doesn't mean the people are radical. The governments may be, but not the people.

Tell me, do you think the MAJORITY of Iraqis are radical, since none of them ever held a peace rally when Saddam was in charge?

[Invayne]

TRUTH: Islam is the most barbaric, backwards, closed minded religion of all. It's reign of terror is undeniable yet some excuse or justify it by saying shit like, "but not all Muslims are like that. You can't judge a whole religion by some fanatics". YET THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT THESE HYPOCRITES DO ABOUT CHRISTIANITY!

A woman was JAILED for naming a teddy bear Mohammed! When those cartoons were published of Mohammed thousands took to the streets in rage ripping their shirts off and screaming death threats! Right, they do not represent the majority of Muslims :lmao:

People have written books and made movies portraying Jesus in a vast number of ways many considered offensive, but how many Americans ran out of their house and ripped their shirts of scream death threats?



:clapper: Indie, I must say I appreciate you more and more every day!

[Invayne]

Oh yeah that was so not biased or bigoted.....

Mic, why are you going off topic babbling about the KKK? This thread is about censorship out of fear of Muslim retaliation. Do you think this type of retaliation doesn't occur? Wake up.

[Invayne]

No, but he used to have a terrorist logo on his avatar and he consitantly sticks up for the folks that DO chant death to all Americans.

Hmmm...interesting.

[Invayne]

Below is actual footage of radical extreme Muslims acting like the KKK. Radical extreme Islam intends to conquer the world through violence.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDPzPgkr4vk&feature=related

Oh come on, Shoe. This is "propaganda" again. Wrong translations. Taken out of "context". What other buzzwords are there? Help me out here.

Leftists will not believe this even after hearing the words from Muslims' own mouths.

[Elrathin]

Leftists will not believe this even after hearing the words from Muslims' own mouths.

Wrong, we just won't be stupid like some on the right that blame ALL Muslims for a few. There are 1.2 Billion Muslims out there folks, and some on the right claim that a MAJORITY are radical Muslims (i.e. the ones that will kill us). If that were really true, there would be HUNDREDS of thousands of terrorist attacks a year.

[Invayne]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article745910.ece



This is rich...

He said: “We totally refuse to be looked upon as terrorists and we totally refuse that these people represent us — they don’t.” He said that the terrorists were “enemies of Islam”.

However, he was critical of the dominance of the West and said that Western values were “hurting the world”.


There's always that "however" that slips in there somehow.:lmao:

[Elrathin]

This is rich...




There's always that "however" that slips in there somehow.:lmao:

Yeah because criticizing America a is being a radical Muslim to you right LOL.

[IndieVisible]

Wrong, we just won't be stupid like some on the right that blame ALL Muslims for a few. There are 1.2 Billion Muslims out there folks, and some on the right claim that a MAJORITY are radical Muslims (i.e. the ones that will kill us). If that were really true, there would be HUNDREDS of thousands of terrorist attacks a year.

Still waiting for a video from inside one of these Muslim nations like Iran, or any where that are not burning a American flag or shouting death to America or Israel. With a billion Muslims should be easy to find no? And for the record I am not a right winger.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UW1AZ4uzZM

[Elrathin]

Still waiting for a video from inside one of these Muslim nations like Iran, or any where that are not burning a American flag or shouting death to America or Israel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UW1AZ4uzZM

Still waiting for you to show where the MAJORITY of the 1.2 billion Muslims are radicals that want to kill us. Your video shows a FRACTION of that.

[IndieVisible]

Still waiting for you to show where the MAJORITY of the 1.2 billion Muslims are radicals that want to kill us. Your video shows a FRACTION of that.

Here is violent demonstration over cartoons!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UufTBjgEE5Q&feature=related

Lost cause El, there certainly are peaceful Muslims, but the vast majority are not. May be in another 200 years the rest of the Muslims may become more civilized.

[Elrathin]

but the vast majority are not. May be in another 200 years the rest of the Muslims may become more civilized.

Nothing you have shown proves the MAJORITY are radicals. Deal with those facts. What you do is the same logical fallacy many Muslim haters do and that's apply to the majority what you see from the minority.

The simple fact is the evidence you have provided does not show the MAJOIRTY.

Oh and protesting America doesn't mean someone is radical. I know many people that hate countries like France, Russia, Saudi Arabia, but that doesn't mean they are radicals.

Some righties think that anyone that doesn't like America is a Radical Muslim.

Hell we have even seen that some people believe all Muslims should be killed, but I guess that is ok to you right?

[IndieVisible]

Nothing you have shown proves the MAJORITY are radicals. Deal with those facts. What you do is the same logical fallacy many Muslim haters do and that's apply to the majority what you see from the minority.

Excuse me? I am not chanting death to Muslims LOL. I don't see any Americans doing that do you? Whats that tell you?

The simple fact is the evidence you have provided does not show the MAJOIRTY.

Ok whatever you say. i can post these types of vids every day, youtube is full of them! Only a few "peaceful" rallys here and there. Again, whats that tell you?

Oh and protesting America doesn't mean someone is radical. I know many people that hate countries like France, Russia, Saudi Arabia, but that doesn't mean they are radicals.

Riiight, they are fun loving peaceful people with no hate lol.

Some righties think that anyone that doesn't like America is a Radical Muslim.

I'm a leftie tho. Sorry, I call it like I see. I am not blinded by stupid party loyalty.

Hell we have even seen that some people believe all Muslims should be killed, but I guess that is ok to you right?

Link please.

Oh btw here is another typical Muslim rally this one in the USA, such fun loving misunderstood people they are LOL!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLK1Xpc7SMQ

Hey El how far you think Americans would have got doing that to a Iranian flag in Iran? :lmao:

[Elrathin]

I don't see any Americans doing that do you? Whats that tell you?



Link please.


Right here on page 2 of this very thread.

I think we can all agree that they should all be killed off, just like the Muslims.

[Elrathin]

Riiight, they are fun loving peaceful people with no hate lol.

So if you are criticize a country, that means you hate and want to kill them automatically?

So here is what we have seen from you. If you criticize a country, that is ok. However, if Muslims criticize America, that means that they want to kill us. That about cover your logic?

[IndieVisible]

So if you are criticize a country, that means you hate and want to kill them automatically?

So here is what we have seen from you. If you criticize a country, that is ok. However, if Muslims criticize America, that means that they want to kill us. That about cover your logic?

Thats what *they* say though! DEATH TO AMERICA! What do you want? them to actually carry it out <again>?

[IndieVisible]

Right here on page 2 of this very thread.

WHERE??? Was it removed?

[IndieVisible]

Totally insane! if Christians did this kind of shit even once every one would be crying foul and point out how arrogant and evil Christians are. But we are bombarded with this kind of crap from Muslims every day and some people claim, oh they do not represent the majority of Muslims. Gimmie a freaking break. Hypocrisy!

[Elrathin]

Thats what *they* say though! DEATH TO AMERICA! What do you want? them to actually carry it out <again>?

Indie, if I were to show all the videos of Code Pink and other radical protesters and then say that is the typical American, that would be the same that you are doing with Muslims.

First of all the majority of Muslims do not even attend protests. Second of all, many just want to live their lives. Do the majority of them not like America? I'd say that could be a safe bet. Do the majority of them want to kill us all? Sorry, don't buy it.

Look if you want to apply what you see on T.V., that is your choice. But the media is biased as well as the news. The main reason these media are in business is not to report the truth, but sell the stories. You won't see the life of the average Muslim because that's boring and most wouldn't watch it. But stick a protest where some idiots say "Death to America" and you will find people are more interested.

But to each their own, I just figured you as a person that wouldn't be duped by the media is all.

[Elrathin]

WHERE??? Was it removed?

I showed you the quote.

Right here is the link. Here is the quote.

I think we can all agree that they should all be killed off, just like the Muslims.

http://www.democracyforums.com/showthread.php?t=16381&page=2

[Elrathin]

Totally insane! if Christians did this kind of shit even once every one would be crying foul and point out how arrogant and evil Christians are. But we are bombarded with this kind of crap from Muslims every day and some people claim, oh they do not represent the majority of Muslims. Gimmie a freaking break. Hypocrisy!

So your logic is that people would wrongly accuse ALL Christians of doing something, so you feel you need to do the same thing to Muslims. Got it.

[IndieVisible]

Indie, if I were to show all the videos of Code Pink and other radical protesters and then say that is the typical American, that would be the same that you are doing with Muslims.

First of all the majority of Muslims do not even attend protests. Second of all, many just want to live their lives. Do the majority of them not like America? I'd say that could be a safe bet. Do the majority of them want to kill us all? Sorry, don't buy it.

Look if you want to apply what you see on T.V., that is your choice. But the media is biased as well as the news. The main reason these media are in business is not to report the truth, but sell the stories. You won't see the life of the average Muslim because that's boring and most wouldn't watch it. But stick a protest where some idiots say "Death to America" and you will find people are more interested.

But to each their own, I just figured you as a person that wouldn't be duped by the media is all.

So I base my opinion on what I see and hear, and read every day, thats a bad thing I'm wrong. You base yours on a hunch not all are bad, thats a good thing. I see.

They not only hate us, and Israel but want to see us suffer and die! They gather every where in the streets chanting death to America. This is not just a few here and there! Those would be the peaceful rallys you like to believe represent the majority.

What I do not get is how you can be so Liberal and NOT see this is wrong and should not be excused at any level. Even the *good ones* who do not want to see us die, enslave their women, and force their ideas on their people. I guess thats ok too though. Never mind the hangings in the streets of Iran of teenagers who were gay.

But your right, each to their own! I do not doubt there are a lot of good Muslim people but they are NOT the majority. If you excuse me I will continue to call it as I see it even as a Liberal I can not deny the obvious.

[IndieVisible]

So your logic is that people would wrongly accuse ALL Christians of doing something, so you feel you need to do the same thing to Muslims. Got it.

Not what I said or mean and you know that. I was pointing out the hypocrisy here. We are civilized. We do not act like animals.

[Elrathin]

So I base my opinion on what I see and hear, and read every day, thats a bad thing I'm wrong. You base yours on a hunch not all are bad, thats a good thing. I see.

No, you don't base it on what you see. You base the MAJOIRTY on what you see of the MINORITY. Like I said, I guess you believe that Code Pink and the other radicals are the typical American then right? Because those are what is seen the most.


What I do not get is how you can be so Liberal and NOT see this is wrong and should not be excused at any level. Even the *good ones* who do not want to see us die, enslave their women, and force their ideas on their people. I guess thats ok too though. Never mind the hangings in the streets of Iran of teenagers who were gay.

We just executed two illegals that came into this country. Now, while I don't have a problem with that personally, there are others out there in the world that look at us as barbaric for it. Does that mean we are radicals for it? To them it looks that way.

I don't particularly like how Shiara law is done in Muslim countries, but does it warrant the killing of every Muslim? Nope. It is their country and we are not the lords and rulers of the world to dictate to other countries what they want.

Short of genocide, their laws are their laws and they are entitled to them. Should we encourage change in their system? Yes, just like other countries encourage changes in ours at times. But it CANNOT be done with force.


But your right, each to their own! I do not doubt there are a lot of good Muslim people but they are NOT the majority. If you excuse me I will continue to call it as I see it even as a Liberal I can not deny the obvious.

And I have contact with Muslim neighbors every day. I have even looked after their kids while they were on vacation. These on not bad people and neither are the majoirty of Muslims.

But believe what you want. I will continue to look at people as individuals and not rush to judgement of a majority from looking at a minority.

[IndieVisible]

I showed you the quote.

Right here is the link. Here is the quote.



http://www.democracyforums.com/showthread.php?t=16381&page=2

Actually here is the entire quote you failed to include it all.

They weren't mass lynchings. However, the KKK isn't a religion. It's a pack-a-asshats. I think we can all agree that they should all be killed off, just like the Muslims.
That's right, because WE have been spankin' their fucking asses.

He is comparing the KKK and Muslims, very similar actually. Muslims bless Hitler and admire him. But I would not kill off a whole race, religion or people. I've advocated being fair to the Palestinians despite my personal opinion of their religion.

apdst was obviously pissed off. I'm sure he is really a good guy, just misunderstood and certainly does not represent all Christians. Feel better? All is ok now again. LOL

[apdst]

Killing off all the Nazis in the world would be genocide? Well, maybe so, but who would really give a shit if we eradicated Nazism? Think about it.

[micfranklin]

Still waiting for a video from inside one of these Muslim nations like Iran, or any where that are not burning a American flag or shouting death to America or Israel. With a billion Muslims should be easy to find no? And for the record I am not a right winger.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UW1AZ4uzZM

Yeah that video is so accurate from just taking random pictures and thus its so not propaganda?

/sarcasm

Mic, why are you going off topic babbling about the KKK? This thread is about censorship out of fear of Muslim retaliation. Do you think this type of retaliation doesn't occur? Wake up.

Nope. Because if so then they'd still be going on and on about that one cartoon. Are they now?

[micfranklin]

Killing off all the Nazis in the world would be genocide? Well, maybe so, but who would really give a shit if we eradicated Nazism? Think about it.

You can compare Nazis to Muslims all day and night but you're still grasping at straws. All Nazis do and have advocated racism and genocide at one point.

Muslims, for the most part don't.

[apdst]

BTW, Mic. I'm not acting like the KKK. I'm calling it like I see it. Too bad you're too blind to see it, too.

[micfranklin]

BTW, Mic. I'm not acting like the KKK. I'm calling it like I see it. Too bad you're too blind to see it, too.

Not a single quote of yours in this thread or any other say otherwise, see my collection of quotes earlier.

[IndieVisible]

No, you don't base it on what you see. You base the MAJOIRTY on what you see of the MINORITY. Like I said, I guess you believe that Code Pink and the other radicals are the typical American then right? Because those are what is seen the most.

apples and oranges. if we demonstrated around the world chanting death then you would have a leg to stand on.


We just executed two illegals that came into this country. Now, while I don't have a problem with that personally, there are others out there in the world that look at us as barbaric for it. Does that mean we are radicals for it? To them it looks that way.

No they got a trial first and were not dragged out in the street and lynched or beheaded like Muslims do in Iran.

I don't particularly like how Shiara law is done in Muslim countries, but does it warrant the killing of every Muslim? Nope. It is their country and we are not the lords and rulers of the world to dictate to other countries what they want.

I'm not talking killing. I'm talking calling it as it is!

Short of genocide, their laws are their laws and they are entitled to them. Should we encourage change in their system? Yes, just like other countries encourage changes in ours at times. But it CANNOT be done with force.

Agreed. Force is their job.

And I have contact with Muslim neighbors every day. I have even looked after their kids while they were on vacation. These on not bad people and neither are the majoirty of Muslims.

Again you misrepresent me. I NEVER said there weren't any good Muslims did I? I simply believe the majority are not so good

But believe what you want. I will continue to look at people as individuals and not rush to judgement of a majority from looking at a minority.

I think your doing it the other way around. Looking at the minority and judging them as the majority. But oh well.

I may be a liberal, but this liberal does not wear rose tinted glass. I am not afraid to break party lines when I feel it's the right thing to do. And to be honest I find I have to it a lot with the Democrats when they get stupid.

[apdst]

Not a single quote of yours in this thread or any other say otherwise, see my collection of quotes earlier.

I'm still waiting for your links to those quotes, so we know you didn't leave out critical context, or doctor them up.

Muslims, for the most part don't.

They don't do it openly. Again, where are all the Muslim leagions killing Muslim terrorists. I mean, for fuck sake, one of our very own mods displayed a fucking terrorist flag on his avatar. With the slogan, "support our troops", along with it, no less.

[AnnEsthesia]

Thats what *they* say though! DEATH TO AMERICA! What do you want? them to actually carry it out <again>?

Nah, we just have our presidential candidates sing "Bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran..."

[apdst]

Nah, we just have our presidential candidates sing "Bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran..."

Iran funds one of the deadliest terrorist orgs in history.

[IndieVisible]

Nah, we just have our presidential candidates sing "Bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran..."

Except he was joking. But I'm sure it was offensive for you. Had Ahmadinejad said that it would have been ok ;)

[AnnEsthesia]

And so was the person with the avatar. However, if someone living abroad heard McCain say that... do you honestly think they would be as forgiving of him 'joking' about it?

[IndieVisible]

And so was the person with the avatar. However, if someone living abroad heard McCain say that... do you honestly think they would be as forgiving of him 'joking' about it?

Depends where, in backwards uncivilized Muslim countries no, they would want to behead MCCain.

But here we just say what a funny avatar. Even if intent was to rattle some cages. :shame:

[apdst]

And so was the person with the avatar.

So, you admit that Jafar is involved with terrorists?

if someone living abroad heard McCain say that... do you honestly think they would be as forgiving of him 'joking' about it?

Can I call someone a nigger, in a joking manner? You would be cool with that?

[AnnEsthesia]

apdst, are you unable to compare two similar things? You seem to have a problem with finding equal things to compare. No, making a racial slur is not the same as having an avatar that could offend someone.

And no, I do not believe Jafar is involved with terrorists, any more than I believe you dress in a white sheet and light crucifixes in your neighbors' yards.

[apdst]

No, making a racial slur is not the same as having an avatar that could offend someone.

Ok, let me get this straight: it's wrong to say nigger, but I, an American, after America suffered the deadliest terrorist attack in history, has to tolerate the display of an obvious Islamic terrorist symbol? Have I got that right?

[micfranklin]

I'm still waiting for your links to those quotes, so we know you didn't leave out critical context, or doctor them up.

The thread name was in the title of the quote, so you can go type in that thread name, find your posts and there ya go.

They don't do it openly. Again, where are all the Muslim leagions killing Muslim terrorists. I mean, for fuck sake, one of our very own mods displayed a fucking terrorist flag on his avatar. With the slogan, "support our troops", along with it, no less.

They don't do it period, the ones who aren't radicalized and out to terrorize the world. You want Muslim legions fighting terrorists, look up the Iraqi Army they seem to be fighting against terrorism in their own country.

[AnnEsthesia]

Ok, let me get this straight: it's wrong to say nigger, but I, an American, after America suffered the deadliest terrorist attack in history, has to tolerate the display of an obvious Islamic terrorist symbol? Have I got that right?

I would explain it to you, but nothing will breach your blind hatred. You are too filled with self-righteous lunacy to even hear what anyone here has to say. Why bother?

[apdst]

The thread name was in the title of the quote, so you can go type in that thread name,

It's YOUR job to support YOUR posts, bro.

#100 Today, 08:47 PM
AnnEsthesia
What are YOU lookin' at? Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 6,131
Reputation: 49




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by apdst
Ok, let me get this straight: it's wrong to say nigger, but I, an American, after America suffered the deadliest terrorist attack in history, has to tolerate the display of an obvious Islamic terrorist symbol? Have I got that right?

I would explain it to you, but nothing will breach your blind hatred. You are too filled with self-righteous lunacy to even hear what anyone here has to say. Why bother?

IOW, you know so little about what you're talking about to even try and make an argument.

[micfranklin]

Well sir, since you said it's also my job to support my own posts...

If we're not trying to destroy Islam, then we should be. Islam is as big a scurge as the Nazis and the Commies.

Not all Muslims are terrorists, but all Muslims condone terrorism.

There are NO legions of Muslims forming to stop Islamic extremism. There are more Muslims that support it, or at the minimum say and do nothing, than there are that are actively fighting against it.

The Religion of Peace 3 (http://www.democracyforums.com/showthread.php?t=14954&highlight=religion+peace&page=2)

Posts #14, #27 and #34 in that thread.

That's Aftrica for ya. You can do what you want to try and make it better, but the reality is, there's no such thing as a successful black government.

Apartheid ended in South Africa, the blacks took control of the government and now South Africa is an even bigger shit-hole than it was before.

A blind eye to Mugabe's reign of terror (http://www.democracyforums.com/showthread.php?t=14364&highlight=terror+mugabe)

Post #9 in that thread

I'm anti-Mulsim the same way I'm anti-Communist, anti-Nazi and anti-KKK. I wear your comments as a badge of honor.

So, it's all about the numbers? The Muslims aren't as bad because they haven't racked the same amount of kills? The point I've been making is that--regardless of numbers--Islam is just as bad as as the Nazis and the Commies. Numbers aside, the Muslims have been in the genocide business of alot longer than anyone else.

Abusive interrogations continue in US (http://www.democracyforums.com/showthread.php?p=177175#post177175)

Posts #135 and #145 in that thread.

You've really got yourself a nice portfolio here.

[jafar00]

go on his avatar and he consitantly sticks up for the folks that DO chant death to all Americans.

Lies!

And I might add they represent the majority of Muslims. It's true there are some peaceful Muslims. Just don't hold your breath looking for too many.

Half a dozen people stomping on a flag in a video doesn't make a majority when there are over 1.5 billion Muslims in the world.

Below is actual footage of radical extreme Muslims acting like the KKK. Radical extreme Islam intends to conquer the world through violence.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDPzPgkr4vk&feature=related

Nice collection of out of context quotes, and rantings of well known nutcases. This idea that Islam wants to take over the world by force is nonsense.

Just show me one video of a gathering of 1000+ Muslims in a peaceful gathering, no burning American flags, no death chants, just one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_v9k9KQYBGM

Actually the radical Muslims are the ones condemning, violence, terrorism and 911...they're the ones going against the grain of current Islam.

No true. Look at this collection of statements from mainstream Islamic leaders.
http://facts-not-fear.blogspot.com/2007/06/muslim-condemnation-of-terrorism-part-8.html

Again, where are all the Muslim leagions killing Muslim terrorists.

From recent memory, did you forget the Sunni tribes in Iraq turning their guns on Al Qaeda?
As for calling for legions of Muslims to go about killing, isn't that incitement? Islam forbids us from committing vigilantism and murder.

[AnnEsthesia]

It's YOUR job to support YOUR posts, bro.



IOW, you know so little about what you're talking about to even try and make an argument.

No, in other words, you have decided that you are right and your opinions are the only ones that matter. You have ceased to debate and instead are just trying to be offensive, all in the name of proclaiming yourself offended.

[IndieVisible]

Lies!



Half a dozen people stomping on a flag in a video doesn't make a majority when there are over 1.5 billion Muslims in the world.


If that was the case you might be right, but the FACT is there are thousands of videos and examples from news stories of this shit happening all over the world on regular basis. Verses one or two "peaceful" rallies LOL!


Nice collection of out of context quotes, and rantings of well known nutcases. This idea that Islam wants to take over the world by force is nonsense.

Yea sure, what ever you say. We know your unbiased about that :)


No true. Look at this collection of statements from mainstream Islamic leaders.
http://facts-not-fear.blogspot.com/2007/06/muslim-condemnation-of-terrorism-part-8.html


Your kidding right? A religious gathering of course will not display hostility or violence, they reserve that for public display of affection for Americans and Jews :lmao:



From recent memory, did you forget the Sunni tribes in Iraq turning their guns on Al Qaeda?
As for calling for legions of Muslims to go about killing, isn't that incitement? Islam forbids us from committing vigilantism and murder.

That was territorial disputes and you know it! I did not expect unbiased reply from you, but I did expect better amo then this!

[Invayne]

Nope. Because if so then they'd still be going on and on about that one cartoon. Are they now?

Why should they kill people over a fucking cartoon in the first place? That's insane. Now people can't get books published out of fear...from what I understand, Salman Rushdie is still in hiding. How many years has that been?

How many Christians did you see rioting and killing people over the DaVinci Code or Piss Christ?

[Invayne]

You can compare Nazis to Muslims all day and night but you're still grasping at straws. All Nazis do and have advocated racism and genocide at one point.

Muslims, for the most part don't.

You deny that the Grand Muffin was working with Hitler to eradicate Jews?

http://www.themiddleeastnow.com/musnazi.html

[Invayne]

Ok, let me get this straight: it's wrong to say nigger, but I, an American, after America suffered the deadliest terrorist attack in history, has to tolerate the display of an obvious Islamic terrorist symbol? Have I got that right?

Leftists feel like we should be the "tolerant" ones while everybody else can shit on us and that's OK.:unreal:

[Shoey]

Nice collection of out of context quotes, and rantings of well known nutcases. This idea that Islam wants to take over the world by force is nonsense.

Nonsense Jafar! The video I posted is ACTUAL footage of radical Muslims from around the globe protesting in the streets proclaiming Islam is the only "superior" religion and their objective is to Islamize the entire world through violence. What YOU may label western "propaganda" I consider truth!

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-871902797772997781&ei=L_GeSPHjGIO24AKNubAf&q=islam+what+the+west+needs+to+know&hl=en

^ Islam: What The West Needs To Know

[Invayne]

Nice collection of out of context quotes, and rantings of well known nutcases. This idea that Islam wants to take over the world by force is nonsense.

Who do you consider the nutcases here? People like that Palestinian cleric or people like Nonie Darwish?




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_v9k9KQYBGM

LOL!! I'll bet the KKK never lynched a black man while they were having church services either!




No true. Look at this collection of statements from mainstream Islamic leaders.
http://facts-not-fear.blogspot.com/2007/06/muslim-condemnation-of-terrorism-part-8.html

What is Taqqiya? And how do we know that's not what's going on here?




As for calling for legions of Muslims to go about killing, isn't that incitement? Islam forbids us from committing vigilantism and murder.

Does this mean the army in Iraq shouldn't be fighting with us to eradicate their enemy? How is that murder? Sounds like self defense to me, which is certainly not murder.

[micfranklin]

Why should they kill people over a fucking cartoon in the first place? That's insane. Now people can't get books published out of fear...from what I understand, Salman Rushdie is still in hiding. How many years has that been?

How many Christians did you see rioting and killing people over the DaVinci Code or Piss Christ?

I don't know why they did it I just know that that was only one incident of major overreaction and you can't use that as a medium for everything else.

Furtheremore what I seem to be understanding from a select few people in this thread, as with every other Religion of Peace thread is that all Muslims everywhere either practice or condone terrorism because said people don't like looking for anti-terrorism Muslim groups.
-Drug dealers and gangs in the inner cities do not represent all black people.
-The KKK and Nazi-type groups do not represent all white people.
-Illegal immigrants do not represent all Mexicans
-Abortion-clinic bombers do not represent all Christians
-Mafias and mobsters do not represent all Italians
-Tamil Tigers do not represent all Hindu Sri Lankans

But for some very odd reason, undoubtedbly bigotry, terrorists represent all Muslim people. There is a serious flaw in that line of logic here.

[IndieVisible]

I don't know why they did it I just know that that was only one incident of major overreaction and you can't use that as a medium for everything else.

One incident? :lmao: Muslim overreact every fucking day!

[Shoey]

One incident? :lmao: Muslim overreact every fucking day!

Muslim(s) overreacting over a short film "Submission" directed by Theo Van Gogh who was brutally murdered by a radical Muslim. :shame:

Working from a script written by Ayaan Hirsi Ali, van Gogh created the 10-minute movie Submission. The movie deals with the topic of violence against women in Islamic societies; telling the stories of four abused Muslim women. The title itself, "Submission", is a translation of the word "Islam" into English. In the film, women's naked bodies are veiled with semi-transparent shrouds as they kneel in prayer, telling their stories as if they are speaking to Allah. Qur'anic verses unfavourable to women are projected onto their bodies in Arabic. In August 2004, after the movie's broadcast on Dutch public TV, newspaper De Volkskrant reported on claims of plagiarism against Hirsi Ali and Van Gogh, made by internet journalist Francisco van Jole. Van Jole said the duo had "aped" the ideas of Iranian-American video artist Shirin Neshat. Neshat's work, which made abundant use of Arabic text projected onto bodies, had been shown in the Netherlands in 1997 and 2000. After the broadcast of Submission, Van Gogh and Hirsi Ali also received death threats. Van Gogh did not take these very seriously and refused any protection, reportedly telling Ayaan Hirsi Ali: "Nobody kills the village idiot", a term he frequently used to refer to himself.[1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQRUjBApmkg

[micfranklin]

One incident? :lmao: Muslim overreact every fucking day!

Including the innocent civilians who get killed in terrorist incidents?

[IndieVisible]

Including the innocent civilians who get killed in terrorist incidents?

What are you trying to say here?

If your saying Muslims kill innocent civilians every day by terror I agree.

[jafar00]

Muslim(s) overreacting over a short film "Submission" directed by Theo Van Gogh who was brutally murdered by a radical Muslim. :shame:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQRUjBApmkg

Murdered by a criminal.

Including the innocent civilians who get killed in terrorist incidents?

Terrorists are criminals and out of the fold of Islam so you can't in any way connect them to Muslims who are, out of the fear of divine retribution mostly law abiding citizens.

Neither of you appear to have read anything in the link I sent previously.
Have another look, then tell me terrorists and radicals are following Islamic teachings again.

http://facts-not-fear.blogspot.com/2007/06/muslim-condemnation-of-terrorism-part-8.html

[IndieVisible]

Murdered by a criminal.



Terrorists are criminals and out of the fold of Islam so you can't in any way connect them to Muslims who are, out of the fear of divine retribution mostly law abiding citizens.

Neither of you appear to have read anything in the link I sent previously.
Have another look, then tell me terrorists and radicals are following Islamic teachings again.

http://facts-not-fear.blogspot.com/2007/06/muslim-condemnation-of-terrorism-part-8.html

I gotta tell you I don't get how some of you people demand sources for proof and bitch and moan when you get blog post, yet when the table is turned thats what you present blog posts! :lmao:

Look Jafar, you may be a good Muslim, I really don't know.

I go by what I read, see, and hear every day from news sources around the world! I've been told that I shouldn't go by that. One of the moderators here says you can not believe the media, they go by a Muslim neighbor they have and a hunch. You give me blog posts and nice words.

Sorry, I think I will go by all the independent mass media coverage from news sources around the world verses you and some neighbor.

[micfranklin]

What are you trying to say here?

If your saying Muslims kill innocent civilians every day by terror I agree.

A lot of innocent civilians who happen to be Muslims as well also happened to be killed by terrorists who are radicalized Muslims.

[IndieVisible]

A lot of innocent civilians who happen to be Muslims as well also happened to be killed by terrorists who are radicalized Muslims.

I sympathize with all women and children who get caught up in the middle of Muslim terror. But By far the greatest terror Muslims use is directed and targeted against America, Israel, and any one or any nation they feel has offended their religion.

[micfranklin]

I sympathize with all women and children who get caught up in the middle of Muslim terror. But By far the greatest terror Muslims use is directed and targeted against America, Israel, and any one or any nation they feel has offended their religion.

Does that include al-Qaeda also?

[jafar00]

You deny that the Grand Muffin was working with Hitler to eradicate Jews?

http://www.themiddleeastnow.com/musnazi.html

Actually, the Mufti met with Hitler because he was offered help in stopping the Zionists from taking over Palestine and also protection from the Jewish Irgun terrorists who were trying to assassinate him. It was nothing about eradicating Jews. He was trying to stop the Jews from eradicating Arabs. Quite the contrary.

[IndieVisible]

Does that include al-Qaeda also?

It saddens me the same seeing children of the KKK dress in white supremacy clothes and garbs. But at least the kkk is not killing any one any more and when they did, they did not send out their women and children to do it. The men did the killing.

http://streetknowledge.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/kkk-child-in-robe.jpg

But yea, it's sad. Muslims are filled with hate and intolerance. The hang people in Tehran streets. Here is photo of young man about to die for being gay. This kind of shit happens every day in Muslim countries!

http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/05pz6wC6FMbTQ/610x.jpg

[micfranklin]

1. Another blanket statement.

2. Where'd you get that second picture from?

[Shoey]

He was trying to stop the Jews from eradicating Arabs. Quite the contrary.

You deny the fact Arabs are guilty of eliminating Jews in Muslim countries? Do you deny the fact Hitler eradicated roughly 6 million Jews? (The Holocaust)

The Jewish Population in the Arab countries between 1948 and 2000


Jewish Population in the year 1948

The Jews of Algeria 140,000
The Jews of Egypt 75,000
The Jews of Iraq 150,000
The Jews of Lebanon 20,000
The Jews of Libya 38,000
The Jews of Morocco 265,000
The Jews of Syria 30,000
The Jews of Tunisia 105,000
The Jews of Yemen 63,000
include Aden: 8,000

All Arab Jews in the year 1948 is 886,000 person

Jewish Population in the year 2000

The Jews of Algeria 100 person
The Jews of Egypt 200 person
The Jews of Iraq 100 person
The Jews of Lebanon 100 person
The Jews of Libya 0 Person
The Jews of Morocco 5,800 Person
The Jews of Syria 200 person
The Jews of Tunisia 1,300 Person
The Jews of Yemen 200 person
include Aden: 8,000

All Arab Jews in the year 2000 is 8,000 person


The expelled Jews from the all Arab countries (886,000- 8,000) are 878,000 person.

[IndieVisible]

1. Another blanket statement.

2. Where'd you get that second picture from?

sorry wrong Tehran hanging pic, so many hard to keep them all in order!

here are the two gays hung in Tehran street which is very common.
Gay Pride Day in Iran!

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index_files/IranExecutesGayTeens.jpg


This guy was whipped by Iranian authorities for having a Bible!

http://www.iranfocus.com/uploads/img46c0d05a7e743.jpg

source (http://persecutedbyislam.blogspot.com/2007_09_01_archive.html)

[micfranklin]

Blogs are the best sources you can come up with?

[jafar00]

You deny the fact Arabs are guilty of eliminating Jews in Muslim countries? Do you deny the fact Hitler eradicated roughly 6 million Jews? (The Holocaust)

Yes I deny Arabs are guilty of eliminating Jews. There is absolutely no historical evidence of anything like that.

You made mention that 878,000 left Arab countries since 1948? Want to keep counts? How about the 7.2 million displaced Palestinian refugees?
Most of the Jews left of their own accord. The Palestinians didn't get that choice.

sorry wrong Tehran hanging pic, so many hard to keep them all in order!


Yes we get the message. I heartily agree with you that the Iranian way is deviant from Islamic laws.

[IndieVisible]

Blogs are the best sources you can come up with?

Oh please don't you start too. The gay hangings was even discussed in this forum! It made major news too!

here is one from fox, it is a major source even if they are slanted,
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,336272,00.html

here is the gay hanging from a human rights org site,
http://www.hrw.org/english/docs/2005/11/21/iran12072.htm

WTF is up with some people who want to deny Muslim hate crimes? IT'S ALL OVER THE INTERNET, you just need to google a bit and have all the sources you want!

[IndieVisible]

Yes we get the message. I heartily agree with you that the Iranian way is deviant from Islamic laws.

Ok name a Muslim country that is better?

[micfranklin]

WTF is up with some people who want to deny Muslim hate crimes? IT'S ALL OVER THE INTERNET, you just need to google a bit and have all the sources you want!

I don't deny some Muslims are guilty of hate crimes, as is any other group. The thing about it is that many of the "sources" happen to come from blog sites with a biased anti-Islamic point-of-view and also happen to either take pictures or quotes out of context or lie about them altogether.

And I saw thereligionofpeace.com site listed in that blog, so don't even try bringing that up because I've searched for some of those details there and many of them don't exist, therefore anyone posting it as a credible source is automatically a bullshitter.

[IndieVisible]

I don't deny some Muslims are guilty of hate crimes, as is any other group. The thing about it is that many of the "sources" happen to come from blog sites with a biased anti-Islamic point-of-view and also happen to either take pictures or quotes out of context or lie about them altogether.

And I saw thereligionofpeace.com site listed in that blog, so don't even try bringing that up because I've searched for some of those details there and many of them don't exist, therefore anyone posting it as a credible source is automatically a bullshitter.

Some Muslims? :lmao: Their whole government and religion is!

[micfranklin]

Some Muslims? :lmao: Their whole government and religion is!

Nope. Otherwise Israel would've been destroyed by now, seeing as how they're pretty much surrounded by Islamic states.

Oh and one other thing, that blog you cited 7 posts ago says there are 57 members of the Organization of Islamic Conference, which is wrong because there's in fact at least 60, if you include the observer states. Just an FYI.

[IndieVisible]

Nope. Otherwise Israel would've been destroyed by now, seeing as how they're pretty much surrounded by Islamic states.

Oh and one other thing, that blog you cited 7 posts ago says there are 57 members of the Organization of Islamic Conference, which is wrong because there's in fact at least 60, if you include the observer states. Just an FYI.

Oh they would have been for sure. You must be too young to remember 1967 6 day war. Egypt, Jordan, and Syria went to war with Israel and Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Tunisia, Morocco and Algeria also contributed troops and arms to the Arab forces. of course they got the shit kicked out of them and Israel ended up with even more land in the process. Another reason Arabs and Muslims hate Israel.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six-Day_War

And why Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's speeches and statements have contributed to increased tensions between Iran and Israel, and between Iran and a few Western nations, "wipe Isreal off the map" speech.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1129540608312&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

Muslims are taught to hate Jews in school and kill!

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23384657-details/We+do+use+books+that+call+Jews+'apes'+admits+head+ of+Islamic+school/article.do
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25106145/

just a few sources for you to chew on before you reject, excuse, and justify again because I'm sure Muslims are just a bunch of misunderstood peace loving people :)

[jafar00]

Ok name a Muslim country that is better?

erm... Malaysia?

Some Muslims? :lmao: Their whole government and religion is!

Islam has a government?

[IndieVisible]

erm... Malaysia?



Islam has a government?

Malaysia where Arabs make up the smallest percentage of the population?

Malaysia where they have a democratic constitution government? Although the Malaysian constitution theoretically guarantees religious freedom, in practice the situation is restricted. All ethnic Malays are Muslim as defined in the Malaysian constitution. Additionally, all non-Muslims who marry a Muslim must renounce their religion and convert to Islam. Once a person becomes Muslim they cannot renounce Islam and convert to another faith. Meanwhile, non-Muslims experience restrictions in activities such as construction of religious buildings and the celebration of certain religious events in some states.

That Malaysia?

Islamic terrorism is there too, throw in more crazy Arabs you will see more!
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C05E2D8123FF930A2575BC0A9669C8B 63

But that was a nice try! A nation far from Arabs, but nevertheless just as intolorant to tother religions and signs of violence WILL increase there too, just watch!

[micfranklin]

Oh they would have been for sure. You must be too young to remember 1967 6 day war. Egypt, Jordan, and Syria went to war with Israel and Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Tunisia, Morocco and Algeria also contributed troops and arms to the Arab forces. of course they got the shit kicked out of them and Israel ended up with even more land in the process. Another reason Arabs and Muslims hate Israel.

So if Israel is the only Jewish state in the world and there's at least 10 Islamic countries in that region, which I would assume would outnumber all of Israel, why aren't they all fighting them?

I mean surely you and others have been implying that Islam as a whole is evil and there are no good Muslims yet Israel still exists and al-Qaeda is almost gone.

And why Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's speeches and statements have contributed to increased tensions between Iran and Israel, and between Iran and a few Western nations, "wipe Isreal off the map" speech.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...cle%2FShowFull

Because Ahmadinejad is a maniacal Holocaust-denying bastard and also does not represent all Muslims worldwide.

Muslims are taught to hate Jews in school and kill!

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/a...ool/article.do
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25106145/

Well the first thing about those stories is that the people in them need to realize that its unacceptable to teach hate in the world. Second these re only a very few cases of this outside Islamic regions.

[IndieVisible]

So if Israel is the only Jewish state in the world and there's at least 10 Islamic countries in that region, which I would assume would outnumber all of Israel, why aren't they all fighting them?

I mean surely you and others have been implying that Islam as a whole is evil and there are no good Muslims yet Israel still exists and al-Qaeda is almost gone.



Because Ahmadinejad is a maniacal Holocaust-denying bastard and also does not represent all Muslims worldwide.



Well the first thing about those stories is that the people in them need to realize that its unacceptable to teach hate in the world. Second these re only a very few cases of this outside Islamic regions.

And does that conclude your deny, justify and excuse reply I said would follow my post? :lmao:

[micfranklin]

And does that conclude your deny, justify and excuse reply I said would follow my post? :lmao:

Really? I justified the teaching of hatred to kids in schools in that post and yet you didn't bother reading the rest of it?

[jafar00]

Malaysia where Arabs make up the smallest percentage of the population?

You said Muslim nation, not Arab. How about Mauritania, Maldives, or Brunei?

[jafar00]

Well the first thing about those stories is that the people in them need to realize that its unacceptable to teach hate in the world.

:)

Ahmadinejad is a maniacal Holocaust-denying bastard

:lmao::clapper::madlaugh:

[IndieVisible]

Really? I justified the teaching of hatred to kids in schools in that post and yet you didn't bother reading the rest of it?

I read your entire post. No matter what proofs you get you are quick to dismiss them as not typical while maintaining you have the same outrage as me over the few exceptions that are undeniable examples of hate.

How about you answer this.

Would you say there is a alarming number of Muslims in the world that either advocate or support terror?

[IndieVisible]

You said Muslim nation, not Arab. How about Mauritania, Maldives, or Brunei?

How about Jordon, Egypt, Iran, Iraq, Lebanon, Syria, Sudan, Saudi Arabia, Libya, United Arab Emirates, Palestine?

[Elrathin]

Would you say there is a alarming number of Muslims in the world that either advocate or support terror?

That is an accurate statement. Finally I can agree with you. :thumbsup:

[Invayne]

Actually, the Mufti met with Hitler because he was offered help in stopping the Zionists from taking over Palestine and also protection from the Jewish Irgun terrorists who were trying to assassinate him. It was nothing about eradicating Jews. He was trying to stop the Jews from eradicating Arabs. Quite the contrary.

"The Mufti was one of the initiators of the systematic extermination of European Jewry and had been a collaborator and adviser of Eichmann and Himmler in the execution of this plan... He was one of Eichmann's best friends and had constantly incited him to accelerate the extermination measures."

Adolf Eichmann`s deputy Dieter Wisliceny in his Nuremberg Trials testimony.
http://www.nyjtimes.com/cover/03-08-05/NaziRootsOfPalestinianNationalism.htm

[Invayne]

Islam has a government?

Religion and government are one in Islam, isn't that right?

[IndieVisible]

"The Mufti was one of the initiators of the systematic extermination of European Jewry and had been a collaborator and adviser of Eichmann and Himmler in the execution of this plan... He was one of Eichmann's best friends and had constantly incited him to accelerate the extermination measures."

Adolf Eichmann`s deputy Dieter Wisliceny in his Nuremberg Trials testimony.
http://www.nyjtimes.com/cover/03-08-05/NaziRootsOfPalestinianNationalism.htm

A chilling accurate report with a solid source, good job!

[Invayne]

That is an accurate statement. Finally I can agree with you. :thumbsup:

So how can you say that "most" Muslims are not violent when you just admitted that most Muslims advocate and support terrorism? If you support it, then you're just as whacked as the people doing it. You're contradicting yourself there.:unreal:

[Invayne]

A chilling accurate report with a solid source, good job!

It won't be accurate enough since it's from the New York JEWISH Times! And we know they spread "propaganda".:dizzy:

[micfranklin]

I read your entire post. No matter what proofs you get you are quick to dismiss them as not typical while maintaining you have the same outrage as me over the few exceptions that are undeniable examples of hate.

How about you answer this.

Would you say there is a alarming number of Muslims in the world that either advocate or support terror?

Depends on what you mean by alarming number, but I'm pretty sure I know what you mean by "alarming."

[IndieVisible]

Depends on what you mean by alarming number, but I'm pretty sure I know what you mean by "alarming."

So this time you skipped deny, excuse and justify and went with DODGE.

:lmao:

[jafar00]

How about Jordon, Egypt, Iran, Iraq, Lebanon, Syria, Sudan, Saudi Arabia, Libya, United Arab Emirates, Palestine?

What about them? By the way, I visited Libya recently. I was surprised at how modern and prosperous it is. Since sanctions were lifted, the Libyans have it pretty good actually. Next to no taxes, you can buy a car for half the price of anywhere else and fuel is about 50c a Gallon. I didn't see anyone on the streets begging either and in restaurants, it's considered bad form to offer a tip.

"The Mufti was one of the initiators of the systematic extermination of European Jewry and had been a collaborator and adviser of Eichmann and Himmler in the execution of this plan... He was one of Eichmann's best friends and had constantly incited him to accelerate the extermination measures."

You know the Mufti's dealings with the Nazis cost him his reputation and his position as a leader right? Don't forget to mention that. He spent the rest of his life in disgrace and exile.

Religion and government are one in Islam, isn't that right?

Wrong. Religion governs the law. Government, while having to follow the law is another thing. Isn't US government supposed to be "Judeo-Christian"(whatever that is) traditions?

Oh, and just to be annoying and on topic, I personally think the publishing house action was a bit of a knee jerk. Didn't the author say she was trying to be respectful? Surely it's as easy fixed as giving the book to a few Muslims or Imams and seeking their advice about it rather than doing the fear thing?

[micfranklin]

So this time you skipped deny, excuse and justify and went with DODGE.

:lmao:

Yeah because I knew my response would trigger a blanket statement from someone. To answer your question I would say that there isn't an alarming number of Muslims who support or condone terrorism.

Let me ask you something else while I'm at it: do you think all black people are either gang members, drug dealers or thieves?

[Elrathin]

So how can you say that "most" Muslims are not violent when you just admitted that most Muslims advocate and support terrorism? If you support it, then you're just as whacked as the people doing it. You're contradicting yourself there.:unreal:

I did not admit that MOST Muslims are violent, I agreed that an alarming number are. To me, anymore than ten thousand is an alarming number.

I did not contradict myself at all, you and I just have a different number for "alarming number".

To put it exactly, Alarming number does not equate to majority.

[Shoey]

Yes I deny Arabs are guilty of eliminating Jews.

What next Jafar, you deny the Holocaust??? :unreal:

The Jewish exodus from Arab lands refers to the 20th century expulsion or mass departure of Jews, primarily of Sephardi and Mizrahi background, from Arab and Islamic countries. The migration started in the late 19th century, but accelerated after the 1948 Arab-Israeli War. According to official Arab statistics, 856,000 Jews left their homes in Arab countries from 1948 until the early 1970s. Some 600,000 resettled in Israel. Their descendants, and those of Iranian and Turkish Jews, now number 3.06 million of Israel's 5.4 to 5.8 million Jewish citizens. [1] The World Organization of Jews from Arab Countries (WOJAC) estimates that Jewish property in Arab countries would be valued today at more than $300 billion[2][3] and Jewish-owned real-estate left behind in Arab lands at 100,000 square kilometers (four times the size of the State of Israel). [1][3]

Reasons for emigration:
While violence and discrimination against Jews in Arab countries started to increase several years before 1948, it escalated significantly starting in 1948 despite the fact that Jews were indigenous and for the most part held Arab citizenship. Sometimes the process was state sanctioned; at other times it was the consequence of anti-Jewish resentment by non-Jews. Harassment, persecution and the confiscation of property followed. Secondly and in response to mistreatment of Jews in these countries, a Zionist drive for Jewish immigration from Arab lands to Israel intensified. The great majority of Jews in Arab lands eventually emigrated to the modern State of Israel.[4] Activist groups such as JJAC and JIMENA claim that there was a collusion among Arab states to persecute Jews as part of their struggle against Israel.[5]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_lands

[lily]

If that was the case you might be right, but the FACT is there are thousands of videos and examples from news stories of this shit happening all over the world on regular basis. Verses one or two "peaceful" rallies LOL!




See this is what I don't understand.......in the "thousands of videos" all over the world......why are all their signs painted in perfect English, with spelling and grammar even better than mine?

[micfranklin]

Don't think too much Lily because I checked Snopes and all those signs that seem to be written in the same font are actually real images.

[jafar00]

See this is what I don't understand.......in the "thousands of videos" all over the world......why are all their signs painted in perfect English, with spelling and grammar even better than mine?

Whenever I see an Egyptian sign in perfect English, I wonder the same thing ;)

[jafar00]

What next Jafar, you deny the Holocaust???

I deny the story used by the Zionists to hold everyone who isn't Jewish hostage for decades since yes. That figure of 6 million is so bogus.

[micfranklin]

It was actually about 12 million people total who got slaughtered by Nazis.

[preservanation]

I see some Muslims as being anti-Jewish.
Is this right, or are they just anti-Israel?

[Shoey]

I see some Muslims as being anti-Jewish.
Is this right, or are they just anti-Israel?

That's a correct assessment preserve. The prophet Mohammed beheaded 600-900 Jews and "most" Muslims that I've spoken to are anti Jewish/Israel.

[micfranklin]

That's a correct assessment preserve. The prophet Mohammed beheaded 600-900 Jews and "most" Muslims that I've spoken to are anti Jewish/Israel.

And that's the problem, who you've spoken to doesn't mean everyone. Furthermore does most mean 3?

[jafar00]

That's a correct assessment preserve. The prophet Mohammed beheaded 600-900 Jews and "most" Muslims that I've spoken to are anti Jewish/Israel.

To what are you referring to there?

[Wndrtch]

No, the americans who rally for peace are called "libbos" and denigrated.

Because they protest against the wrong people!

Go protest in the ME if you want to protest for peace. There are too many barbarians posing as Mullahs, who are using a religion to promote hatred of "unbelievers". Not unlike early Christianity with the Inquisition, accept the tools of destruction are far more destructive.

Protesting agaisnt people trying their best to keep your family safe, is rather foolish, and should be laughed at, IMO.

[AnnEsthesia]

Because they protest against the wrong people!

Go protest in the ME if you want to protest for peace. There are too many barbarians posing as Mullahs, who are using a religion to promote hatred of "unbelievers". Not unlike early Christianity with the Inquisition, accept the tools of destruction are far more destructive.

Protesting agaisnt people trying their best to keep your family safe, is rather foolish, and should be laughed at, IMO.

Why would I, as an American, go to another country and protest? That is absurd. I have the right to protest for change in my own country. I do not have that right abroad. Perhaps this is the mentality that has gotten us in this situation?

[Wndrtch]

Why would I, as an American, go to another country and protest? That is absurd. I have the right to protest for change in my own country. I do not have that right abroad. Perhaps this is the mentality that has gotten us in this situation?

So, your not actually interested in creating any actual "peace". You just want to create "change" in our Government?

It's good to know that the "peace" movement, doesn't care about making peace happen anywhere.

And don't you think the fact that you cannot travel abroad and be free to speak your mind, say something about the state of the World?

[Elrathin]

So, your not actually interested in creating any actual "peace".

Does the fact that you don't protest for peace in another country mean that you don't want peace in the world?

[AnnEsthesia]

So, your not actually interested in creating any actual "peace". You just want to create "change" in our Government?

It's good to know that the "peace" movement, doesn't care about making peace happen anywhere.

And don't you think the fact that you cannot travel abroad and be free to speak your mind, say something about the state of the World?

Of course I want peace! But you cannot scream at people and make them change. Nor can you force them to change. Really, would you listen if some Chinese or Russians came here and held a long and loud protest against the US? Somehow I doubt it.

The only government we have a right to change is our own. But you know that.

[Wndrtch]

Of course I want peace! But you cannot scream at people and make them change. Nor can you force them to change. Really, would you listen if some Chinese or Russians came here and held a long and loud protest against the US? Somehow I doubt it.

If your neighbor is throwing rocks at your house and breaking windows, do you stand in your own yard and protest your parents because they responded to it?

And IF a Russian or Chinese envoy came to America to protest American policies, they would be allowed to speak, and our media would pass them along to the rest of us to digest in our in ways. If they did it every month for years, I bet many would start to see their point of view. Tell something big and often, and it becomes truth to many after a while. That's what national "marketing" is all about.

Besides, many Americans now, believe in what Moscow and Beijing are preaching.

The only government we have a right to change is our own. But you know that.

Not entirely true. We have the right to change any foreign govenrment that threatens our own peace and tranquility.

We "changed" the Afghanistan and Iraqi governments. Afghanistan because of 911, and Iraq because it failed to comply with the 1991 cease fire agreement they signed, ignored 17 UN Resolutions (of which, the US is a charter nation) and it was US law.


Iraq Liberation Act of 1998
105th Congress, 2nd Session
September 29, 1998
http://freedomagenda.com/iraq/wmd_quotes.html#Lof9huGeMd
http://globalsecurity.org/wmd/library/news/iraq/1998/980929-in2.htm

Regime change in Iraq has been official US policy since 1998. The Iraq Liberation Act of 1998, signed into law by President Clinton, states:

"It should be the policy of the United States to support efforts to remove the regime headed by Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq and to promote the emergence of a democratic government to replace that regime."


Senator Harry Reid (Democrat, Nevada)
Addressing the US Senate
October 9, 2002
Congressional Record, p. S10145
http://freedomagenda.com/iraq/wmd_quotes.html#Bu2pEtWhKr
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/
cgi-bin/getpage.cgi?position=all&page=S10145&dbname=2002_record


"We stopped the fighting [in 1991] on an agreement that Iraq would take steps to assure the world that it would not engage in further aggression and that it would destroy its weapons of mass destruction. It has refused to take those steps. That refusal constitutes a breach of the armistice which renders it void and justifies resumption of the armed conflict."













We need to make more "changes" like that, IMO. Man (or woman) should not have to fear speaking his/her mind, no matter where they travel on Earth.

It should have been the main focus of the UN over the last 60 years, but there were too many "peace-nicks" to get anything accomplished.

[AnnEsthesia]

Someone attacking you is different than going to another country and thinking you have the right to impose your ideas upon them. I have the right to voice my opinion of the way my government and society is and how it could be. I do not have that right to do that to others.

[Invayne]

I deny the story used by the Zionists to hold everyone who isn't Jewish hostage for decades since yes. That figure of 6 million is so bogus.

Oh my. You can't be serious.:unreal:

[Invayne]

Protesting agaisnt people trying their best to keep your family safe, is rather foolish, and should be laughed at, IMO.

That is the actions of an idiot.

[IndieVisible]

I deny the story used by the Zionists to hold everyone who isn't Jewish hostage for decades since yes. That figure of 6 million is so bogus.

So you deny 6 Million Jews were killed. What number you believe in? And you base this on what?

Can't imagine why you would object to me saying the majority of Muslims support terrorism. I base my opinion on independent news reports from around the world.

BTW answer me this. In Muslim religion, if your daughter wanted to marry a Jew would you be happy, object, how would that work? Could she marry? Would marriage be recognized by your religion?

[apdst]

Well, technically, Jafar is correct. There weren't six million Jews killed during the Holocaust. There were approximately 6 million people put to death in the concentration camps, but not all of them were Jews.

That being said, it's irrelevant if there were 6 million Jews killed, or 600,000 Jews killed during the Holocaust.

I guess someone's true colors are shining through. I wonder where the Libbos are, on this one.

[apdst]

And that's the problem, who you've spoken to doesn't mean everyone. Furthermore does most mean 3?

That's right and when the Libs drag their Muslim pards out of the closet, braggin about how wonderful they are, it don't mean shit.

[micfranklin]

Well, technically, Jafar is correct. There weren't six million Jews killed during the Holocaust. There were approximately 6 millio