If Gay Marriage was Legal [Archive]

underdawg

10-06-2006, 04:56 AM

If gays were allowed to marry. What do you imagine the worst case senario to be?
I am a bit curious to know what others think.

1. God will come down with all his wrath and smite the USA.

2. More children will be sexually abused

3. More children will grow up to be gay

4. When straight couples see gays get married, their own marriage will fail

5. Your neighbor might wind up getting married to a goat

6. Your child will see how cool it is and will want to be gay himself

7. People will be pissed off but will get over it

8. Nothing bad would happen

9. Gays would find marriage as boring as straight people do

10. More gay divorses

11. other

bobbylien

10-06-2006, 05:01 AM

7. People will be pissed off but will get over it

8. Nothing bad would happen

sbannon

10-06-2006, 05:51 AM

11. other -- uptight (mostly Christian) conservatives will see that #1 on the list doesn't actually happen and it will drive them crazy.

Labrocca

10-06-2006, 07:22 AM

I would like to debate this with you but I have one question.Â*Â*Do you believe that gays are born gay or that environment was a factor?Â*Â*

Because if environment is a factor then:

6. Your child will see how cool it is and will want to be gay himself

If however you think there is a gay gene then I may argue differently with you.Â*Â*I have met gays that have said both.Â*Â*What's your position?

underdawg

10-06-2006, 08:00 AM

Well I can honestly say that I never chose nor wanted to be gay. As a child very early on, I could tell something was quite different about me, but I wasn't sure what it was. I did have a tendency to like to draw and do artwork. I do notice that a lot of other gays I have met seem to have this in common as well.Â*Â*When I started to reach my teen years I found myself becoming attracted to boys instead of girls. I tend to think that some children are born with a predisposition for it, but I don't think that is the entire story. I also think that perhaps it may be a change in the mothers hormones that effect the growing fetus at a certain time during its developement. I am just guessing about that. because I really don't know how it happened. All my brothers grew up to be straight and we all grew up in the same environment. I was never abused. I never met another gay person growing up. Growing up in the deep south from a very conservative family, homosexuality was never discussed. When other guys were getting crushes on girls, I felt nothing.

I think I will ask you the same question. Maybe it will make more sense. When did you realize you were straight? Did you know from an early age? Did you make a concious choice to find girls attractive or did it just feel natural?Â*Â*Do you feel that you were born heterosexual and that it was genetic for you? If you think it was a choice, or someone persuaded you to be straight, do you remember it?

Labrocca

10-06-2006, 08:59 AM

I remember being 3 or 4 and being interested in girls. I played "show me yours and I will show you mine" at age 4. My mom went nuts when I was rolling naked with a naked girl in a bed. We didn't know what we were doing but I knew that boys and girls did this kind of thing. Maybe the TV game me this idea? Maybe it was something I saw from my mother and father.

My guess is that it's not genetic. My guess is that at some very early age a child gets a tendency. Also it's my guess that those who become gay may simply be uncomfortable around girls almost to the point of a paranoia which triggers something. When sexual feelings then occur they go toward the sex they are either comfortable with or intrigued by.

As a father of 4...I know my kids 100% follow my example in MANY things. They do things they see on TV or do things their friends do.

If a gay gene is found do you think you can be "fixed" with gene therapy? If it's a gene then is it a mental defect from birth? I am a darwinist in my beliefs. If by chance homosexuality is something to end that person gene pool by eliminating procreating...then that may explain a "gay gene". It's a part of my logic and reasoning that I don't believe gay couples should marry nor have kids. I am not against my friends...I am more against the philosophy of homosexual lifestyle. It doesn't fit into my neat little reality I have disillusioned myself with.

From Wikipedia:
Social Darwinism
Main article: Social Darwinism

In 1944 the American historian Richard Hofstadter applied the term "Social Darwinism" to describe 19th- and 20th-century thinking developed from the ideas of Thomas Malthus and Herbert Spencer, which applied ideas of evolution and "survival of the fittest" to societies or nations competing for survival in a hostile world. These ideas became discredited by association with racism and imperialism. Though the term is anachronistic, in Darwin's day the difference between what was later called "Social Darwinism" and simple "Darwinism" was less clear. However, Darwin did not believe that his scientific theory mandated any particular theory of governance or social order. Indeed, he believed that sympathy should be extended to all races and nations.

The use of the phrase "Social Darwinism" to describe Malthus's ideas is particularly disingenuous, since Malthus died in 1834 before the inception of Darwin's theory was spurred by his reading the 6th edition of Malthus' famous Essay on a Principle of Population in 1838. Spencer's evolutionary "progressivism" and his social and political ideas were largely Malthusian, and his books on economics of 1851 and on evolution of 1855 predated Darwin's publication of the Origin in 1859.

underdawg

10-06-2006, 09:37 AM

My guess is that genetics might play a part in it. But since Homosexuality has been found existing in human history as far back as at least Alexander The Great and maybe beyond, I would suspect the gene must have been important in our evolution or else it would have been lost long ago. In the same way that one gene for sickle cell anemia from one parent protects blacks from getting malaria, a double dose from both parents makes sickle cell anemia. Perhaps it is the same with a possible gay gene. If you get one from one parent it helps you in some way, both get it from both parents and you would have a gay kid. it would make sinse when you see one gay kid in a family and the rest are straight. Kinda like a roll of the dice. There are a lot worse things in life than being gay. I have two brothers that are retarded and one who is straight but has a big drug problem and can't hold down a job. At least he gave my mom grandchildren. I turned out to be the more independent and adventurous one.

However kids become gay, I really don't think it is something that can be controlled. And I certainly don't think any parent intends for their child to be gay, it just happens some how. I certainly don't think a gay parent would want his kid to be gay either. Even gays want grandchildren. And they don't want their children to have to go through the hardships of growing up gay as they did because being teased was not very fun.

Elrathin

10-06-2006, 01:41 PM

I would say 8,9, and 10

Of course 10, because if you have marriages, you will have divorces. That is just how it is.

piratemonkey

10-06-2006, 06:57 PM

I would like to debate this with you but I have one question.Â*Â*Do you believe that gays are born gay or that environment was a factor?Â*Â*

Though there are almost always environmental influences, there isn't even debate anymore between biologists as to the answer to this question.

Sexual preference has a very strong, proven congenital component (NOT genetic - this difference is key).Â*Â*Genes determine what it's possible to do congenitally, but enviromental factors in the womb are the main influencers.

Take a female fetal mouse.Â*Â*Inject her with an androgen during a very specific 3 day window of development.Â*Â*When that female mouse is an adult, she will ALWAYS attempt to mount other female mice and NEVER let male mice mount her.

Birth order studies, neurological morphology studies and studies done with WWII birth records confirm these findings. If anyone wants references to these studies, say the word. They are primary journal articles, which makes 'em pretty thick.

The science is very, very clear.Â*Â*There is no debate about this in the scientific community... most people just don't know the science.

underdawg

10-06-2006, 07:22 PM

I haven't read the study, but it sounds pretty reasonable. Parents always wonder what they may have done wrong in their child rearing to produce a gay child. I really don't believe that it is anything that someone does or says to produce this outcome.

On a personal level. I really don't see it as a disease any more than being left handed is a disease. Its not like a handicap where you need medicines, special devices or operations to function. It is just different.

rodeojones903

10-06-2006, 07:52 PM

I choose the goat option.

underdawg

10-06-2006, 08:11 PM

Thats funny, That slippery slope issue always made me laugh. The image of a goat with a wedding dress saying I doooooooooo.

underdawg

10-06-2006, 09:06 PM

On a more personal level. I don't think anyone should get married. I wouldn't do it. Its a lot easier just to live together. Weddings are just too damned expensive and I hate dressing up. I also can't imagine being able to make a promise to remain together till death do you part. How are you supposed to know how you will feel about that person after 20 years?Â*Â*And if you got divorsed, that would be an expensive nasty affair. Stuff like that make me glad that I am gay and don't have to have problems like that.

If people want to defend marriage, then they should outlaw divorse. If someone knew that they would actually be stuck with someone till death do you part, perhaps they might put more thought into getting married in the first place. Might see a slight rise in the murder rate though.

In some ways I feel thankful that I am gay. I never had to worry about getting someone pregnant. No one can ever accuse me of being a deadbeat dad, nor will I ever have to pay child support. Since I don't have a family to support, I have more money to help my mom in her old age. If you are monogamous and don't do drugs, there is really no reason to worry about catching AIDS.

Labrocca

10-06-2006, 10:40 PM

I would like to debate this with you but I have one question.Â*Â*Do you believe that gays are born gay or that environment was a factor?Â*Â*

Though there are almost always environmental influences, there isn't even debate anymore between biologists as to the answer to this question.

Sexual preference has a very strong, proven congenital component (NOT genetic - this difference is key).Â*Â*Genes determine what it's possible to do congenitally, but enviromental factors in the womb are the main influencers.

Take a female fetal mouse.Â*Â*Inject her with an androgen during a very specific 3 day window of development.Â*Â*When that female mouse is an adult, she will ALWAYS attempt to mount other female mice and NEVER let male mice mount her.

Birth order studies, neurological morphology studies and studies done with WWII birth records confirm these findings.Â*Â*If anyone wants references to these studies, say the word.Â*Â*They are primary journal articles, which makes 'em pretty thick.

The science is very, very clear.Â*Â*There is no debate about this in the scientific community... most people just don't know the science.

Links please? I would like to read up on this research that you claim proves all this.

sbannon

10-06-2006, 11:05 PM

I'd like those links as well please. I just saw this on a Discovery documentary a few weeks ago and have been intending to do some more looking at it myself, hopefully the links will speed that up for me.

piratemonkey

10-06-2006, 11:32 PM

Will do. They are definitely interesting reading. Believe it or not, some of these studies are decades old already.

I have most of this at my office, which I won't be at until Monday, though. Maybe I can troll around the internets this weekend and find a few for you. :)

Thanks for your interest. It's refreshing to see people who want to see factual evidence!

DHard3006

10-06-2006, 11:46 PM

Court rules again against the perversion of homosexuality.
California ban on same-sex marriage upheld
http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/10/05/gay.marriage/index.html

piratemonkey

10-06-2006, 11:48 PM

Here's one to get you going.

One problem with referencing primary journal articles, is that they are almost never available for free online.Â*Â*The entire study can be gotten if you have access to PubMed, or in any medical library.

Neonatal androgen and mounting behaviour in female house mice
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=944542&dopt=Abstract

This article isn't the original study done on this topic... it was a follow-up study to figure out why mutant strains don't exhibit the same level of mounting behavior as wild-type strains.Â*Â*But much of the information is in there.

More to come...

Elrathin

10-07-2006, 01:48 AM

Court rules again against the perversion of homosexuality.
California ban on same-sex marriage upheld
http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/10/05/gay.marriage/index.html

It's funny that same court ruled against guns. I guess you really ARE for that court aren't you?

DHard3006

10-07-2006, 03:59 AM

It's funny that same court ruled against guns.Â*Â*I guess you really ARE for that court aren't you?
Well gun hater are you referring to the same court that ruled against the perverted homosexual city gun ban?

Elrathin

10-07-2006, 03:19 PM

Well gun hater are you referring to the same court that ruled against the perverted homosexual city gun ban?

I wasn't aware of a gun ban for just homosexuals. Plesae nelighten us.

DHard3006

10-07-2006, 04:28 PM

I wasn't aware of a gun ban for just homosexuals.Â*Â*Plesae nelighten us.
Are you mad defender of the perversion of homosexuality because it is ok to ban the perversion of homosexual marriage?
A homosexual city in CA attempted to ban handguns. The same court that ruled against the perversion of homosexual marriage also ruled against the handgun ban.
Now play your perverted childish games because you are angry with the courts.

Elrathin

10-07-2006, 05:46 PM

Are you mad defender of the perversion of homosexuality because it is ok to ban the perversion of homosexual marriage?
A homosexual city in CA attempted to ban handguns. The same court that ruled against the perversion of homosexual marriage also ruled against the handgun ban.
Now play your perverted childish games because you are angry with the courts.

Ummm not everyone that lives in San Francisco is gay and the gun ban is for all there, so again, please enlighten us how this is a ban on guns for ONLY homosexuals as you claimed?

piratemonkey

10-07-2006, 06:43 PM

Now play your perverted childish games because you are angry with the courts.

I don't think Elrathin's statements were in any way childish.

I found a great summary article on the history of human sexuality research.Â*Â*Now this is a secondary article, so not as authoritative and passed through one more filter.Â*Â*BUT, it's much easier to read.

Here it is:
http://www2.hu-berlin.de/sexology/GESUND/ARCHIV/LIBRO.HTM#Y87

A couple interesting passages:
But what biological factors are involved? Currently there is a vast and growing literature documenting a hormonal influence on gender behavior and the impact of prenatal h ormones on the brain.

Diamond holds that the growing physiological data are impressive. He has argued that prenatal hormones exert influence on neural pathways and the neural endocrine axis (the link between the hypothalamus, the pituitary gland, and the other endocrine glands). These neural pathways control future hormonal production and consequently influence sexual behavior. He has argued that there are separate neural pathways for sexual identity as a male or female, sexual object choice, sexual pattern for maleness or femaleness, and the sexual response pattern.61

DHard3006

10-07-2006, 06:46 PM

Ummm not everyone that lives in San Francisco is gay and the gun ban is for all there, so again, please enlighten us how this is a ban on guns for ONLY homosexuals as you claimed?
You just made my point defender of the perversion of homosexuality.

Great news CA court up holds the ban on the perversion of homosexual marriage.

Elrathin

10-07-2006, 07:06 PM

Great news CA court up holds the ban on the perversion of homosexual marriage.

Great news CA court also holds up ban on guns. Bet your soo proud of them now aren't you?

piratemonkey

10-07-2006, 07:55 PM

You just made my point defender of the perversion of homosexuality.

Are you reading this thread?

What do you think of the factual, biological evidence I've posted as to the congenital nature of sexual preference?

Do you have contrary evidence? Or is your standpoint pure, unvarnished opinion?

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 01:56 PM

Do you have contrary evidence?Â*Â*Or is your standpoint pure, unvarnished opinion?
What fact do you not understand defender of the perversion of homosexuality? Nature made it impossible for people to reproduce by homosexual sexual intercourse.
Now to point out a very simple fact when perverted homosexual engage in sexual intercourse both perverted homosexuals only use the same sexual organ. It takes two sexual organs from people of a different sex to reproduce.
Oh wait you will now give the animals do it line from people that defend the perversion of homosexuality. Animals do a lot of things people do not allow. I can remember going to the zoo and watching monkeys throw feces at people. Are you going to condone that behavior now?

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 02:06 PM

Nature made it impossible for people to reproduce by homosexual sexual intercourse.

So reproduction is your proof that gay marriage should be illegal? There are a lot of so called "perversions" in society that are quite legal. How do you explain those?

piratemonkey

10-10-2006, 02:10 PM

Do you have contrary evidence?Â*Â*Or is your standpoint pure, unvarnished opinion?
What fact do you not understand defender of the perversion of homosexuality? Nature made it impossible for people to reproduce by homosexual sexual intercourse.

Your point is valid only if:

1) Sex is only for reproduction.
2) You, personally, don't engage in sex for any reason other than to fertilize an egg.
3) You, personally, don't engage in any sex act other than intercourse and then only often enough to impregate a woman.

Since sex is definitely has purposes other than reproduction and I bet you aren't a saint in the sack, your point is hypocritical.

It's trivial to shoot down simplistic argument like this.Â*Â*Try again...

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 02:23 PM

So reproduction is your proof that gay marriage should be illegal?Â*Â*There are a lot of so called "perversions" in society that are quite legal.Â*Â*How do you explain those?
Well defender of the perversion of homosexuality start naming them.

Your point is valid only if:

1) Sex is only for reproduction.
2) You, personally, don't engage in sex for any reason other than to fertilize an egg.
3) You, personally, don't engage in any sex act other than intercourse and then only often enough to impregate a woman.
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality and feces throwing I never said any of the above bs things did I?
Do you need a course in sexuality?
Since sex is definitely has purposes other than reproduction and I bet you aren't a saint in the sack, your point is hypocritical.
Typical response from a defender of the perversion of homosexuality.
It's trivial to shoot down simplistic argument like this.Â*Â*Try again...Â*Â*
ROTFLMFAO.......................Hey defender of the perversion of homosexuality do you ever hurt your arm panting yourself on your back? LOL! Insert smiley face here.

piratemonkey

10-10-2006, 02:39 PM

Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality and feces throwing I never said any of the above bs things did I?
Do you need a course in sexuality?

Heh heh.

This is what I expected.Â*Â*Not an ounce of rational argument.

What you fail to comprehend is that your position makes no logical sense if 1 -3 aren't true.

So if you aren't saying those things, your position is meritless.

If you are condemning homosexuals because their sex acts don't make babies, then you better be sure all of your sex acts result in babies or you're a hypocrite.

If you can't see the inconsistency in your viewpoint, you don't belong on a debating website.

ROTFLMFAO.......................Hey defender of the perversion of homosexuality do you ever hurt your arm panting yourself on your back? LOL! Insert smiley face here.

As long as your arm doesn't hurt from whacking off... that doesn't produce babies.

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 02:41 PM

Well defender of the perversion of homosexuality start naming them.

Spanking your partner, Cross Dressing, Hurting your partner with chains, whips, leather, etc. How's that for a start? These things are LEGAL for people to do, assuming the partner is ok with it, but is considered perverted by most.

As for perversion, that is all relative to society and is not absolute. It used to be "perverted" for blacks to marry white people. That has changed as well.

ECW

10-10-2006, 02:57 PM

I wish gay marriage were legal and then gays could start feeling the misery the rest of us have to endure.

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 03:33 PM

Spanking your partner, Cross Dressing, Hurting your partner with chains, whips, leather, etc.Â*Â*How's that for a start?Â*Â*These things are LEGAL for people to do, assuming the partner is ok with it, but is considered perverted by most.
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality I believe these are called fetishes.
3. object arousing sexual desire: something that arouses sexual excitement in somebody, e.g. an inanimate object or nonsexual part of the body

Where does it say perversion?

piratemonkey

10-10-2006, 03:56 PM

Where does it say perversion?

So this guy is trying to claim homosexuality is a perversion, but your wife giving you a hand job isn't.

Ignoring the fact that DHard :) doesn't seem to be able to distinguish between sexual orientation and sexual acts,
Neither are effective methods of reproduction... what's the difference?

He doesn't seem to be able to give us that answer...

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 04:19 PM

Â*Â*
Heh heh.

This is what I expected.Â*Â*Not an ounce of rational argument.
Gee defender of the perversion of homosexuality and feces throwing stating simple fact is what you cannot comprehend.
Â*Â*What you fail to comprehend is that your position makes no logical sense if 1 -3 aren't true.
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality and feces throwing I never said sex was only for reproduction. Go back and quote where I said this.
I simply stated because it is impossible for perverted homosexuals to reproduce is what makes homosexuality a perversion. See defender of the perversion of homosexuality and feces throwing no mention of what you are claiming.
Â*Â*If you are condemning homosexuals because their sex acts don't make babies, then you better be sure all of your sex acts result in babies or you're a hypocrite.
Again we see the ignorance of the defender of the perversion of homosexuality and feces throwing. Where did I say what you are posting?
ROTFLMFAO.......................Hey defender of the perversion of homosexuality do you ever hurt your arm panting yourself on your back? LOL! Insert smiley face here.Â*Â* [/quote]

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 04:43 PM

3. object arousing sexual desire: something that arouses sexual excitement in somebody, e.g. an inanimate object or nonsexual part of the body

Where does it say perversion?

Well then homosexuality isn't a perversion because a guy using a penis on another guy arouses sexual desire for that couple, fiting the bill to the definition of fetish.

See how the definition game is played now?

piratemonkey

10-10-2006, 04:56 PM

Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality and feces throwing I never said sex was only for reproduction. Go back and quote where I said this.
I simply stated because it is impossible for perverted homosexuals to reproduce is what makes homosexuality a perversion.

Um... exactly.Â*Â*that's kinda the point.Â*Â*You're making my argument for me.Â*Â*Thanks.

Here's what you stated:

What fact do you not understand defender of the perversion of homosexuality? Nature made it impossible for people to reproduce by homosexual sexual intercourse.
Now to point out a very simple fact when perverted homosexual engage in sexual intercourse both perverted homosexuals only use the same sexual organ. It takes two sexual organs from people of a different sex to reproduce.

So you said:
It's impossible for homosexuals to reproduce.
Because it's impossible for homosexuals to reproduce, their behavior is a perversion.

So your reason for calling homosexuality a "perversion" is that it doesn't result in reproduction.

What I, and most rational people, see from your argument is that ANY sexual act that doesn't result in reproduction HAS to be catagorized as a perversion, or your argument is self-contradictory.

Again, your wife's handjob doesn't result in reproduction, so it HAS to classified in the same way as homosexuality, if childbirth is the measure you've chosen to use.

Why you can't see that, I'm not really sure.

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 05:11 PM

[ See how the definition game is played now?
Again defender of the perversion of homosexuality.Â*Â*Where does it say perversion?

So you said:
It's impossible for homosexuals to reproduce.
Because it's impossible for homosexuals to reproduce, their behavior is a perversion.

It is pathetic when a defender of the perversion of homosexuality must attempt to provoke a fight to get a person banned.
You defender of the perversion of homosexuality cannot even quote people properly!

Another fine example of the character traits of a person that defends the perversion of homosexuality.

Game over you lose!

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 05:13 PM

Again defender of the perversion of homosexuality. Where does it say perversion?

You used the definition of fetish for what I said, of course it isn't gonna say it. So I used the definition of fetish for homosexuality. Show me in the definition of fetish where it says perverted, that's what homosexuality is, a fetish.

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 05:15 PM

Game over you lose!

Yes, you have lost, thanks for admitting it.

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 05:21 PM

Show me in the definition of fetish where it says perverted, that's what homosexuality is, a fetish.
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality you may want to re read the definitions of the two words.
Game over as usual and as usual the defenders of perverts lose.

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 05:23 PM

Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality you may want to re read the definitions of the two words.
Game over as usual and as usual the defenders of perverts lose.

I did read it, and it fits the dfeinition, so right back at you game over, you lose. Prove where homosexuality is NOT a fetish by what I said about homosexuality. Until you can do that, YOU LOSE, good day.

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 05:28 PM

We are see a prime example of the character of the people that defend the perversion of homosexuality.

What do perverted homosexuals claim homosexuality is? I believe they claim it is a sexual orientation.

Now we get a defender the perversion of homosexuality claiming it is a fetish.

Homosexuality is a perversion for the simple fact it is impossible for perverted homosexuals to reproduce.

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 05:33 PM

Homosexuality is a perversion for the simple fact it is impossible for perverted homosexuals to reproduce.

That may be YOUR reasoning, but it's incorrect. Show me where it says that if something cannot reproduce it is perverted. Just show me where you are getting this information.

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 05:36 PM

you are getting this information.

Lost again did you?

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 05:37 PM

you are getting this information.

Lost again did you?

I didn't lose, just proving that your whole argument is BS.

PROVE it then, show me where it says that something that cannot reproduce is perverted as you claimed.

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 05:43 PM

Lost again did you?
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is called nature. Can nature write?

Lost again did you?

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 05:45 PM

Lost again did you?
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is called nature. Can nature write?

Lost again did you?

Nope you lost, nature doesn't write, but yet here you are interpreting something as perveted and then claiming it as fact. That isn't proof, that is OPINION.

So defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, you lose again.

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 05:54 PM

So defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, you lose again.
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is called fact.
When heterosexuals engage in sexual intercourse there is the possibility of the conception of a child. When perverted homosexuals engage in sexual intercourse there is no possibility of the conception of a child.Â*Â*Why you ask? Simple because the needed material is not present in perverted homosexuals.

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 05:56 PM

Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is called fact.

Ah defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a pervesion, but a fact can be proven, yet you have claimed that nature didn't write anything down, so it can't be proven and is only YOUR OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion. Nature may have not done the same with animals as with man because man is different. Yet you can't prove that one way or another.

Or do you deny that man is different than animal.

Lost again did you?

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 06:01 PM

but a fact can be proven,
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is every time a child is conceived. Something perverted homosexuals cannot do.
Lost again did you?

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 06:04 PM

but a fact can be proven,
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is every time a child is conceived. Something perverted homosexuals cannot do.
Lost again did you?

Ah Defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion it is NOT PROVEN that it is a perversion, only that it is different. You cannot prove the plans of nature with mankind with regards to homosexuality. This could be intended to be this way to control population of man, and therefore not a perversion.

Your comments are OPINION, not fact. One fact you cannot back up. Lost again did you?

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 06:07 PM

Â*Â*Lost again did you?
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is every time a child is conceived by a heterosexual couple is proving the simple fact that it is impossible for perverted homosexuals to reproduce.

Lost again did you?

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 06:13 PM

Lost again did you?
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is every time a child is conceived by a heterosexual couple is proving the simple fact that it is impossible for perverted homosexuals to reproduce.

Lost again did you?

Ah Defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, that isn't a PROOF, it is an opinion. As I said it could be something that nature intended to happen as population control for man. PROVE what I said is wrong.

So Defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion are you just going to post the same OPINION over and over again without proving anything, just saying your opinion is fact?

Lost again did you?

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 06:37 PM

So Defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion are you just going to post the same OPINION over and over again without proving anything, just saying your opinion is fact?

Lost again did you?

Again defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is simple fact that perverted homosexuals cannot reproduce. That is not an opinion, that is simple fact.

Since imitation is the most sincerest form of flattery one must pay attention when the defenders of the perversion of homosexuality imitate the person speaking out against their perversion.

Lost again did you?

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 06:44 PM

Again defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is simple fact that perverted homosexuals cannot reproduce.

Ah Defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, it is an OPINION that it is perverted. I think you need to read a dictionary to learn the difference between fact and opinion.

Yes, Defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, homosexuals do not reproduce, HOWEVER the REASON for it is AN OPINION in your case. You, Defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, say it is perveted, when it could be intended as population control for man and NOT PERVERTED.

One must take a look in the case of DHard3006 that he cannot prove the REASON is perverted so he substitutes it as fact instead.

One must also take a look in the case of DHard3006 that since he cannot prove it, he repeats the same stuff over and over again, hoping that it will pass as fact when it really is opinion.

Lost again did you?

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 06:53 PM

One must also take a look in the case of DHard3006 that since he cannot prove it, he repeats the same stuff over and over again, hoping that it will pass as fact when it really is opinion.
Lost again did you?

Again defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is simple fact that perverted homosexuals cannot reproduce. That is not an opinion, that is simple fact.

Hey defender of the perversion of homosexuality prove my fact wrong.Â*Â*

Gee speaking out against the perversion of homosexuality is repeating oneself. Notice that the defender of the perversion of homosexuality does not considered that the defender of the perversion of homosexuality is repeating his or her self.

Hey defender of the perversion of homosexuality prove my fact wrong.

Since imitation is the most sincerest form of flattery one must pay attention when the defenders of the perversion of homosexuality imitate the person speaking out against their perversion.

Lost again did you?

sbannon

10-10-2006, 07:30 PM

DHard3006, you seem stuck like a broken record on the notion that if sex between humans can't lead to reproduction it's a perversion. But, what about the 15% of heterosexual couples around the world who can't conceive through natural sexual relations for various reasons--are their sex life and acts a perversion as well?

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 07:38 PM

piratemonkey

10-10-2006, 07:55 PM

So you said:
It's impossible for homosexuals to reproduce.
Because it's impossible for homosexuals to reproduce, their behavior is a perversion.

It is pathetic when a defender of the perversion of homosexuality must attempt to provoke a fight to get a person banned.
You defender of the perversion of homosexuality cannot even quote people properly!

Another fine example of the character traits of a person that defends the perversion of homosexuality.

Game over you lose!

Huh?

You responded to logical argument with personal insults and you think you won?

I stated your argument and I'm attempting to get you banned?

I misquoted you? Where? Show us where or you have been caught in a documented lie... not the best way to achieve credibility. Since I copy and pasted your quotes, I know for a fact they are accurate. What does that make you?

Tip: If someone gives you rational, logical reasons for something, attacking the person is considered an ad hominem attack, is logically invalid and will get you sanctioned by any fair moderator.

It's a shame you think your argument is so weak that you have to resort to personal attack.

It shows the depth of your position, though.

underdawg

10-10-2006, 08:10 PM

Homosexuals can and do have children everyday. Closeted homosexuls can marry the opposite sex and have children, also in order to have children, gays and lesbians will concieve a child together, or they can donate sperm to sperm bank. Homosexuality doesn't make you infertile, It just lessens your chance of having sex with the opposite sex. For those who condemn the ones who have sex and are infertile, you are also condemning heterosexuals who are unable to concieve, people with downs syndrone, women who have gone through menopause. Condemning homosexuality because of a fertility issue is a very poor argument.

DHard3006

10-10-2006, 08:53 PM

Huh?

You responded to logical argument with personal insults and you think you won?

No defender of the perversion of homosexuality and feces throwing I replied to a poster that cannot quote a person.
You defender of the perversion of homosexuality and feces throwing cannot go back and find one quote from me saying what you posted.

Oh and yes, you lose again!

Homosexuals can and do have children everyday. Closeted homosexuls can marry the opposite sex and have children, also in order to have children, gays and lesbians will concieve a child together, or they can donate sperm to sperm bank.
Gee if I remember the closet perverted homosexuals that do this did it to hide their perversion. And how did these closet perverted homosexuals do this? They had sexual intercourse with a female. YesÂ*Â*they had heterosexual sexual intercourse to have a child.
Donating sperm to impregnate a female is still heterosexual reproduction, not homosexual reproduction.
For those who condemn the ones who have sex and are infertile, you are also condemning heterosexuals who are unable to concieve, people with downs syndrone, women who have gone through menopause.Â*Â*
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality these people have a legitimate medical reason for not being able to reproduce, not a perverted lifestyle choice or as the perverted homosexuals like to call it sexual orientation.

underdawg

10-10-2006, 09:17 PM

I fail to see the reasoning behind whether homosexuals can produce children or not. I haven't seen anything on the news lately that even hinted that human population was so low that we have been placed on the endangered species list.

sbannon

10-10-2006, 11:49 PM

But, what about the 15% of heterosexual couples around the world who can't conceive through natural sexual relations for various reasons--are their sex life and acts a perversion as well?
What are the reasons the 15% of heterosexual couples cannot conceive a child? Medical, injury, or choice?
What is the one reason perverted homosexuals cannot reproduce? It is simply impossible!
Are you going to compare perverted homosexuals inability to reproduce to heterosexuals that have a medical, injury or choice reason for not reproducing?
I didn't compare anyone to anyone else. You seem to be stuck on non-reproductive sexual acts being a perversion so I asked if you apply the same logic to heterosexual couples.

You still haven't answered that question though. You instead asked another, "What is the one reason perverted homosexuals cannot reproduce? It is simply impossible!"--to which I would reply that many of the heterosexual couples who can't conceive a child through sexual relations also don't because it's 'simply impossible' for them. So, I'll again ask, are they perverted in your mind as well or not?

Elrathin

10-10-2006, 11:50 PM

Again defender of the perversion of homosexuality it is simple fact that perverted homosexuals cannot reproduce. That is not an opinion, that is simple fact.

Hey defender of the perversion of homosexuality prove my fact wrong.

Ah Defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, yes, it is a fact that homosexuals do not reproduce in the way you say.

What is OPINION is that the reason you give for that is that it is perverted.

What you, defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion have done is taken a fact, but then given an OPINION to the reasoning behind it.

Thus, you have been proven wrong defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion in that your so called fact that it is a perversion is actually an OPINION not a fact.

Thank you for playing and may I suggest you defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion get a dictionary to learn the difference between fact and opinion.

piratemonkey

10-11-2006, 12:22 AM

You defender of the perversion of homosexuality and feces throwing cannot go back and find one quote from me saying what you posted.

Show me a quote that's wrong.

(The fact is, I know you can't, because every quote was copy-pasted.)

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 12:30 AM

I didn't compare anyone to anyone else.
Again defender of the perversion of homosexuality you were told why these heterosexuals cannot reproduce.
TheyÂ*Â*have a medical reason. This could mean they were born with improperly formed reproductive organs.
They had an injury that damaged the reproductive organs.
They had an illness that damaged the reproductive organs.
They choose to not reproduce by using birth control measures.

None of the above apply to perverted homosexuals. Perverted homosexuals cannot reproduce simply because it is impossible.
"What is the one reason perverted homosexuals cannot reproduce?
Again defender of the perversion of homosexuality after I posted why some heterosexuals cannot reproduce. Notice defender of the perversion of homosexuality the word â€œsomeâ€. Not all as with perverted homosexuals.
Ah Defender of the
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality you are not even worth replying to since you lack the ability to come up with a response of your own.
Again defender of the perversion of homosexuality imitation is the most sincere form of flattery. That means copying a person defender of the perversion of homosexuality.
Show me a quote that's wrong.
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality and throwing feces I refer to the above post!

Oh and yes you lost yet again defenders of the perversion of homosexuality!

underdawg

10-11-2006, 12:38 AM

When I started this thread I asked a question what do you think would happen if gay marriage were legal. Just stating that it is a perversion, and saying that homosexuals can not have children is not really an answer. Perhaps if you could put aside the anger and the name calling and think about how you think gay marrige will change things or how it will affect you or your family, perhaps we will have something to ponder about.

Elrathin

10-11-2006, 12:44 AM

Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality you are not even worth replying to since you lack the ability to come up with a response of your own.
Again defender of the perversion of homosexuality imitation is the most sincere form of flattery. That means copying a person defender of the perversion of homosexuality.

As has been proven you, defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, have run away like a scurrying rat.

You, defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, CANNOT PROVE AS FACT that the reason behind homosexuals not being able to procreate is a perversion. Your OPINION is now noted and your FACT IS DEBUNKED.

Lost again didn't you.

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 12:48 AM

angerÂ*Â*
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality the only anger is from your side.
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality with your post about population are you attempting to claim perverted homosexual sex is a birth control measure? After all a heterosexual couple can perform the same sexual acts perverted homosexuals can. And yet a heterosexual couple can also reproduce.
Dang must bite when you lose a argument!

Elrathin

10-11-2006, 12:54 AM

Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality the only anger is from your side.

You, defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, have FAILED to show that it is a perversion in the first place. Hence why you ran away.

Lost again didn't you?

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 01:06 AM

To point out a simple fact to the perverted defenders of the perversion of homosexual marriage. That there CA court stated homosexual can marry just like heterosexuals. What that means perverted defenders of the perversion of homosexuality is you can marry just as do heterosexuals do.

underdawg

10-11-2006, 01:21 AM

Sometimes you just have to sit back and chuckle... Broken records are hard to reason with.

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 01:38 AM

Broken records are hard to reason with.

You cannot comprehend that the CA court has ruled perverted homosexuals can marry just like heterosexual couples can.

underdawg

10-11-2006, 01:56 AM

What do you think will happen because of this? Do you plan to run down the street flailing your arms, and yelling obscenities because homosexuals can marry? How do you think this will affect you?

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 03:34 AM

What do you think will happen because of this?Â*Â*Do you plan to run down the street flailing your arms, and yelling obscenities because homosexuals can marry? How do you think this will affect you?Â*Â*
Well defender of the perversion of homosexuality you must only post replies to act like a troll. If you had read the CA court ruling you would know it stated banning the perversion of homosexual marriage is not against the law. It stated since homosexuals can marry people of a different sex like heterosexual do there was no discrimination.

Elrathin

10-11-2006, 04:19 AM

Well defender of the perversion of homosexuality you must only post replies to act like a troll. If you had read the CA court ruling you would know it stated banning the perversion of homosexual marriage is not against the law. It stated since homosexuals can marry people of a different sex like heterosexual do there was no discrimination.

Well, defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, there have been times when people used to think that a black and white person marrying was a perversion and they outlawed that.

That goes to show people such as yourself, defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, can be wrong in their assessment of what is perverted and what is not.

underdawg

10-11-2006, 04:20 AM

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 05:29 AM

I said, IF, gay marriage were legal how would it affect you. You go off in bizzar tangents about homosexuals being infertile, and then go off talking about a court ruling in Ca, but you never seem to be able to say anything about how you think things would change.Â*Â*I feel like that I am on a bus and sitting near one of those odd people who talk to themselves.

Well defender of the perversion of homosexuality simply because homosexuality is a perversion is how it will affect me!

Do not pull that consenting adult crap out because we do not allow a lot of thing consenting adults do.

Labrocca

10-11-2006, 06:04 AM

Ugh..I just realized you never actually created a poll. Please do so asap.

sbannon

10-11-2006, 10:27 AM

Do not pull that consenting adult crap out because we do not allow a lot of thing consenting adults do.
... and let freedom ring

piratemonkey

10-11-2006, 02:09 PM

Well defender of the perversion of homosexuality simply because homosexuality is a perversion is how it will affect me!

Rational and logical argument. :rolleyes:

Let's test your hypothesis:
My next-door neighbors are gay and just got married last weekend.Â*Â*How has your life changed?

Wait.Â*Â*No they didn't.Â*Â*They're getting married next weekend.Â*Â*Is your life back to normal now?

:D

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 02:25 PM

Elrathin

10-11-2006, 03:07 PM

[Oh that is right they defended the perversion of homosexuals marriage.

Well, Defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, that is because it is only an OPINION of a perversion.

The leftist aka progressives attacked god.

The only thing the left has attacked is for your kind to FORCE prayer in schools against others will.

The leftist aka progressives attacked the right to bear arms.

I hate to break it to you, defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, but even conservatives do not want guns in schools.

You have not learned anything!

You, defender of the OPINION that homosexuliaty is a perversion, have not learned anything is correct.

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 03:18 PM

Elrathin

10-11-2006, 03:32 PM

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 03:40 PM

sbannon

10-11-2006, 03:41 PM

... and let freedom ring
Gee and this is from a gun banning leftist aka progressive.

Let us see what cost the leftist aka progressives the white house and other elected offices.
Oh that is right they defended the perversion of homosexuals marriage.
The leftist aka progressives attacked god.
The leftist aka progressives attacked the right to bear arms.

You have not learned anything!

I certainly have learned something, you have zero capacity for reading comprehension. Perhaps you should run for President.

I have told you over and over, and my postings on this forum provide proof, that I've never supported a gun ban of any sort. I've never attacked God--and unlike you I even show the proper respect of capitalizing the G in God--why do you disrespect the Lord like that? I have also never attacked the right to bear arms.

If you continue to just make crap up and post it about me I will begin to return that behavior in kind.

This forum is a great place to have rational and sometimes heated discussions and debates, but it requires atleast a minimal aptitude for reading comprehension and civility. If you can't rise to that challenge perhaps you'd be happier holding these discussions with yourself? I know it would make me happier.

Elrathin

10-11-2006, 03:46 PM

ROTFLMFAO......................................... .................................The defender of the perversion of homosexuality CANNOT DISPROVE THE FACT THAT IT IS IMPOSSIBLE FOR PERVERTED HOMOSEXUALS TO REPRODUCE. So as usual they resort to disruption.

And you, Defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is perversion, cannot prove that the reason behind it is because it is a perversion.

Lost again didn't you?

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 03:56 PM

I have told you over and over, and my postings on this forum provide proof, that I've never supported a gun ban of any sort.
Ah defender of the perversion of homosexuality do you mean like your post about â€œother then gun control what can be done about school shootingsâ€?
Pretty much has all of the trappings of a gun hater! keep playing your game of I did not say this. 70 or more years of the leftist aka progressives attack on the right to bear arms have made people aware of the catch words spewed by gun haters.

The leftist aka progressives have turned the great undecided group of American voters against them because of their stance on the perversion of homosexual marriage, gun control and their attack on god. Oh and leftist aka progressives just because I mention the leftist aka progressives attack on god dos not make me a religious person.
I just prefer to be around these people right now because of the leftist aka progressives stance on the before mentioned things. You know that great undecided group of voters that vote.

piratemonkey

10-11-2006, 04:28 PM

This guy is a troll.

He's not engaging in any actual debate.
He doesn't respond to challenges (i.e. he accuses me of misquoting him, but can't show where).

He's just name-calling in an echo chamber.

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 04:45 PM

This guy is a troll.Â*Â*
This is coming from a defender of the perversion of homosexuality that cannot even quote a person properly.

And to you defender of the perversion of homosexuality goes the Presidential hand salute! LMFAO...............

The perversion of homosexuals marriage is allowed per a recent CA court ruling. Perverted homosexuals just cannot marry a person of the same sex.

sbannon

10-11-2006, 04:51 PM

Well, DHard3006, asking what ideas people have--specifically other than gun control--on reducing gun violence as I did in the thread you mentioned, is the exact opposite of supporting gun bans. But, it would require those reading comprehension skills that you obviously lack to grasp that.

After multiple attempts now I've come to the conclusion that you're useless to try and discuss anything with. I won't try again here.

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 05:04 PM

But, it would require those reading comprehension skills that you obviously lack to grasp that.
Look at the anger from a defender of the perversion of homosexuality.

Angry are you because people see leftist aka progressives for what they are?

Anti god,
Anti gun,
And pro the perversion of homosexual marriage!

The swing vote continues to swing to the other side!

Elrathin

10-11-2006, 05:52 PM

Angry are you because people see leftist aka progressives for what they are?

Anti god,
Anti gun,
And pro the perversion of homosexual marriage!

Well defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion you have proven NONE of those things above.

Thank you for playing, Lost again didn't you?

DHard3006

10-11-2006, 05:59 PM

Elrathin

10-11-2006, 06:14 PM

You are not worth replying to. Your post are like flying over large areas of emptiness, nothing to see! LOL

Oh and yes as usual you will copy this because you lack the ability to come up with your own response. Oh and hey perverted defender of the perversion of homosexuality the more I post that, the more you think it angers me.

ROTFLMFAO......................................... .................................The defender of the perversion of homosexuality CANNOT DISPROVE THE FACT THAT IT IS IMPOSSIBLE FOR PERVERTED HOMOSEXUALS TO REPRODUCE. So as usual they resort to disruption.

This type of harassment can be found on a web site operated by the hate group called actup. A hate group of angry perverted homosexuals mad at the world because they have aids! All this hate group of perverted homosexuals can do is harass people for speaking out against the perversion of homosexuality.

WOW and
YOU LOSE YET AGAIN!Â*Â*Inset President BUSHâ€™s hand salute!

Notice how the defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, just keeps repeating the same thing over and over and over andover again.

The defender of the OPINION that homosexuality is a perversion, cannot refute any of the claims made and therefore just starts repeating nonsense over in an attempt to smokescreen the inadequencies of his posts.

Thank you for proving once again the troll like status of your posts.Â*Â*

Lost again Didn't you?

piratemonkey

10-11-2006, 06:20 PM

I'm going to try one more time.

If you think that the inability to reproduce is what makes homosexual acts a perversion...

Then why aren't any other sexual acts that don't end up making babies (masterbation, oral sex) also a perversion?

Prove me wrong. Show us you aren't a troll.

Labrocca

10-11-2006, 08:35 PM

hehe...and on a side note:

http://www.google.com/search?rls=en&q=defender+of+the+perversion+of+homosexuality

piratemonkey

10-11-2006, 09:04 PM

hehe...and on a side note:

http://www.google.com/search?rls=en&q=defender+of+the+perversion+of+homosexuality

Good idea.

'splains a lot, eh?

Labrocca

10-11-2006, 09:26 PM

Also enough with the "troll" comments. Either add to the discussion or keep out of it. That goes for all sides. Keep it civil please.

Thank you.

lily

10-11-2006, 11:26 PM

I'd also like to add, if I see the same thing just C&Ped over and over, from both sides, the posts will be deleted.

false_creeds

10-21-2006, 06:20 PM

So the arguement is:

The govt shouldn't endorse a bonding that can't produce kids naturally?

That homosexuality happens through natural means in the womb, but not genetically though DNA?

It has gotten off subject and after reading about 11 pages where only a combined total of 2 pages of posts are on target, I'd like to know where we are at.

I haven't voted because the best option isn't there. I'm not sure, but I'm somewhere between the slippery slope of allowing any adult to marry any other adult(s) and the opinion that it isn't exactly the best thing to promote in a society.

But the 'born with it' raises a question. If a test is deveoped that can show that you'll have a 99.9% chance of having a baby that will be gay, would that be an acceptable reason for abortion. Would the religious begin to favor abortion or would the left begin to go against it? Maybe a little of both.

askates

10-22-2006, 04:14 AM

Wow, its really disturbing that someone would even consider killing their baby because it was gay, but you raise a valid point, some of the posts ive read on this site definitely point to the likelyhood that some of you might serious entertain that thought, and lets face it you do represent a quantitiy of American mindsets. What if they did legalizing aborting gay fetuses, and after a few years they realized that their gene research was unfounded and there is no way to predetermine a childs sexual affiliation? Talk about a a buzzkill! regardless there is an interesting book called the "The Velvet Rage", it talks about parents instinctually knowing that their child is gay, producing a father who tries to be overly masculine, and mother who sweeps in to protect. Not prize winning material, but an interesting spin.

false_creeds

10-22-2006, 04:52 PM

I'm typically against abortion in all forms, but I do see a need for them in some cases.

People do it for economic reasons, for disabled reasons, and just because they want to reasons. I don't see why they wouldn't because the kid would be gay.

By a simliar test if they could identify and test the serial murderer or pedophile gene or hormone or whatnot, would that be a legit reason too? Off topic I know.

piratemonkey

10-23-2006, 02:01 PM

People do it for economic reasons, for disabled reasons, and just because they want to reasons.Â*Â*I don't see why they wouldn't because the kid would be gay.

This argument is beside the point.

There is no "gay"-specific gene, because homosexuality is congenital. Genes can give tendencies toward or against the likelihood of homosexual preference, but most of the determination happens after fertilization, in the womb.

Homosexuality is mostly an environmental effect... the environment being the mother's uterus and androgens doing most of the effecting.

Again, this is evidenced by birth-order and twin studies.