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AlonzoMourning23
08-20-2006, 09:26 PM
WASHINGTON — She may be the country's most popular Democrat. But no other public figure may be as controversial and reviled as New York Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton.



Nearly half the country dislikes her for one reason or another. And while other potential 2008 presidential candidates barely raise anyone's blood pressure, people who despise the former first lady are passionate, almost obsessive, in their hatred.

Scores of conservative talk shows, books and anti-Hillary Web sites portray the New York Democrat as an ambitious, calculating woman riding on her husband's coattails to push an extreme liberal agenda, undermine traditional values and position herself to run for president.

Right-wing Web sites such as BlogsAgainstHillary.com are filled with negative commentary on the first lady's liberal views. One site even sells anti-Hillary apparel, mugs, tote bags and teddy bears emblazoned by an "Anyone But Hillary 2008" slogan.

"She is just very ruthless; she's not to be trusted," said John McAvoy, 50, a retired foreign service officer and conservative Republican in Fairfax, Va.

"She just rubs me the wrong way from marital (relationship) to (liberal) policies to how she behaves," McAvoy said. "She would be a terror as president."

To her supporters, Clinton has the right qualities for a presidential candidate: smart lawmaker, skilled politician and sharp lawyer. But that same resume inspires fear and even loathing among some of her detractors, particularly social conservatives. They see her as a threat to family values and as a liberal in a moderate's clothing. Some are uncomfortable with the notion that a woman could be elected president.

For most, it is simply that she is the wife of Bill Clinton, whom they despised and attacked throughout his administration. Many continue to question her motives for staying with him after the Monica Lewinsky scandal. Most believe she is moving toward the political center solely for a presidential bid, but would emerge as the "dragon lady of the left" if elected.

"There's not a Democrat they'd like to defeat more than Hillary," New York pollster John Zogby said. "These are people who simply hate her guts because she is married to Bill Clinton and stuck with him. She also broke the mold of what an American woman and American wife should be in their view."

Indeed, the average conservative has not forgotten Bill Clinton's infidelities and believes Hillary Clinton protected him to advance her own political ambitions.

"How many women would have hung around," said Terrell Spence, 59, a conservative Republican from Centreville, Va. "I guess I don't like that idea of swinging off her husband's shirttails and hanging on during all the adversity because her sole purpose in life is to be the first lady president."

Normally, ambition is considered a positive quality, particularly for a potential presidential candidate. But when you mix it with gender, "it suddenly becomes like something unholy," especially in Clinton's case, said Thomas Schaller, political scientist at the University of Maryland, Baltimore County. "A lot of people have a certain issue with a strong, accomplished women."

The right's dislike of Hillary Clinton goes back to her husband's first presidential campaign, when she defended him against charges of infidelity and herself as a professional woman, conservative commentator John Podhoretz writes in a new Hillary Clinton book, "Can She Be Stopped?"

Clinton's remark during a "60 Minutes" interview that she wasn't "sitting here — some little woman standing by my man, like Tammy Wynette" was viewed by conservatives as mocking traditional marriage as expressed in a song by the popular country music singer.

"Hillary hatred sprang to life at that moment," Podhoretz wrote. "Whatever her marriage was, and is, it certainly did not look like the kind of union traditionalists liked or appreciated."

Conservatives were aroused again when Clinton, facing questions about a legal issue, said, "I suppose I could have stayed home, baked cookies and had teas, but what I decided was to fulfill my profession."

"I thought she shot herself in the foot right then and there because she insulted all the stay-at-home mothers," said LouAnn Gutzman, 50, a conservative Republican from Wrightstown, Wis., and a stay-at-home mom at the time.

But it's not just the right that is unhappy with Clinton. Democrats disappointed by her vote for the Iraq war and efforts to move to the political center have broadened the dislike of Clinton. Liberals fear she is calculating in a way that might lead her to sell out their position, said Democratic pollster Thomas Riehle.

Polls have consistently shown Clinton as a polarizing and divisive figure but have sometimes swung in her favor. The number of favorable opinions of her increased during the Lewinsky scandal when she was generally seen as the victim. But in June, 51 percent said they liked her and 44 percent said they didn't — a rather high unfavorable score for someone who might run for president.

Clinton's advisers acknowledge that she is unlikely to win over conservatives and Republicans who intensely dislike her. But they believe she can reverse some negative opinions, as she's done in New York in the last six years by letting people get to know her better.

"If you go back to those early polls in New York, you might see that people . . . only knew of her from a national political debate in which she was more symbol than real," said Ann Lewis, Clinton's chief campaign spokeswoman. "But when she goes out and campaigns, meets with people and talks with them about their concerns and her values and what she hopes to do about it, those numbers change."


http://www.thnt.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060820/NEWS/608200509/1001

And there is plenty of encouraging news for her in the latest Time poll. More than half of those surveyed -- 53% -- said they had a favorable impression of her; she registered higher than the other most familiar names in the potential Democratic field, Al Gore (49%), John Edwards (46%) and John Kerry (45%).

http://edition.cnn.com/2006/US/08/20/coverstory.tm/

PittsburghAfterDark
08-20-2006, 09:32 PM
SOURCES: TIME turns this week's cover into a ballot on Hillary Clinton, inviting readers to vote whether they 'love her' or 'hate her.'Â*Â*Readers can check their preference on the cover and mail it in...

This is on Drudge's front page.Â*Â*This is going to be one of the most interesting outcomes you can imagine in American politics.

Rider
08-21-2006, 02:56 PM
Hillary was responsible for the travel office fiasco and the false charges against Billy Dale.

Hillary "lost" the Rose Law firm billing records until they were no longer a threat to her or Bill. They then mysteriously turned up in a box setting on a white house table.

Hillary answered "evasively" over one hundred times while testifying in front of a grand jury.

One of her staffers was caught red handed compiling dossiers from over 900 classified FBI files on politicians, friend and foe.

She was deeply involved in the White Water Development scandal along with her husband. All of the co-conspirators went to jail, including the Governor of Arkansas. Susan McDougal went to prison rather than testify to the grand jury.

All of this has been carefully smoothed over and confined to quiet file drawers by her toadies in the media.

From the articles posted here it's obvious that the left wing media is still running interference for her.

edited for word correction

dsanthony
08-21-2006, 03:25 PM
Hilary can't win the nomination, or the presidency. The leftist "doves" or vultures as I prefer to call them, are making a run at the party as they did in 68. Hilary has played both sides of the fence for decades, but it won't work in the primaries.

And, if she is elected, there aren't many "swing" voters for her to persuade. Everyone already has their opinion of her, and those opinions won't be changed by any campaign commercials. Her negatives are just too high out of the starting gate.

Rider
08-21-2006, 08:54 PM
I wouldn't bet that she can't win the nomination or the presidency. What if the Republicans run another Dole (no disrespect to this fine American hero)?

dsanthony
08-21-2006, 09:01 PM
Dole got the repub nomination because no other major figure wanted to run against Clinton... they knew they would lose.

Actually, Clinton got the 92 nomination for the same reason. Throughout the primaries, bush sr. looked unbeatable. Cuomo and other major figures didn't want to run against him. Then, when the economy went south and the supposed "wimp factor" starting weighing in, Clinton already had the nom wrapped up.

PittsburghAfterDark
08-21-2006, 09:55 PM
Clinton became President in 92 winning 43% of the popular vote.

Never forget that.

He didn't get 50% in 96 either..

Nathan Brazil
08-22-2006, 07:28 PM
I wouldn't bet that she can't win the nomination or the presidency. What if the Republicans run another Dole (no disrespect to this fine American hero)?


From all I've heard, they plan on running McCain, a sell America first guy if there ever was one, but, decried now as "centrist", he'll be instantaneously transformed into Attila the Hun if he gets the nomination, and the left will push their Red Queen for all the whore's worth.

The only hope America has is if all Republicans temporarily switch parties and get Mr. Ketchup, the American Giggle-o, nominated by the Democrats again.

And, hopefully, maybe, McCain will get pancreatic cancer and die before he has a chance to really screw us over.

Rider
08-24-2006, 03:01 AM
McCain would be (as usual) the darling of the media and chattering classes. They would be stroking him like mad...until he won the nomination and went up against the "Red Queen" (I like that one).

The Republicans are truly a bunch of political boobs. They seem to make the same mistakes over and over again. Support for the President and the Republicans in congress has fallen primarily because of their abandonment of conservative principles. So, naturally they react by moving farther to the left.

Actually, it would be interesting to see the Dems get back into power at the height of the war. How would they handle the war without enraging their base?

Nathan Brazil
08-24-2006, 06:28 AM
"Red Queen" (I like that one).

I'm just the parrot. "Red Queen" was coined by Thee Humble Waffle, as close to a genius with words I've ever talked to. He could write rhyming metered stream of consciousness verse ... in real time.

His expressions of vitriolic disgust with all things Clinton was coupled with a dominating hatred of baby murderers, and he had this incredible skill with words. Imagine deadly dust bunnies, if you will

He just vanished, years ago. It wouldn't surpise me to find out that the FBI nabbed him, sometimes his verse tended towards the violent.

But I've always loved the term "Red Queen".